All Blacks 2025
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@MN5 said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan said in All Blacks 2025:
@sparky said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan New Zealand used to have extra rugby smarts to make up for lower player numbers than England, South Africa and France. Not any more.
I expect those three nations with their huge resources to pull away in the next few years.
I think small countries can compete with bigger countries in sport - such as how Jamaica is consistently the biggest rival to the US in sprinting despite having a population of only 3 million.
HOWEVER, what you can't afford is waste and inefficiency. Your decision making at all levels of the game have to be very accurate. You need the smartest people in charge making the decisions so that you are always able to use your resources wisely. One bad appointment or poor decision can cripple you. I would say in that sense the AB hiring process for a coach has to be unbelievably thorough next time around. The vetting needs to be through the roof.
I think the Black Caps well and truly dismissed that "small country vs big country" nonsense with their 3-0 victory over India ( population over a billion ) IN INDIA......and of those billion people a fair few of them are into Cricket.
Trotting out the "SA and France have bigger populations" is just not facing up to the fact they are quite simply better at the moment. It's not like their populations have grown by tens of millions in the last few years.
True. If it all came down to biggest populations India (for example) would be way better at the Olympics across all disciplines. Culture and intellect play a big part of sporting success.
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@nonpartizan said in All Blacks 2025:
@MN5 said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan said in All Blacks 2025:
@sparky said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan New Zealand used to have extra rugby smarts to make up for lower player numbers than England, South Africa and France. Not any more.
I expect those three nations with their huge resources to pull away in the next few years.
I think small countries can compete with bigger countries in sport - such as how Jamaica is consistently the biggest rival to the US in sprinting despite having a population of only 3 million.
HOWEVER, what you can't afford is waste and inefficiency. Your decision making at all levels of the game have to be very accurate. You need the smartest people in charge making the decisions so that you are always able to use your resources wisely. One bad appointment or poor decision can cripple you. I would say in that sense the AB hiring process for a coach has to be unbelievably thorough next time around. The vetting needs to be through the roof.
I think the Black Caps well and truly dismissed that "small country vs big country" nonsense with their 3-0 victory over India ( population over a billion ) IN INDIA......and of those billion people a fair few of them are into Cricket.
Trotting out the "SA and France have bigger populations" is just not facing up to the fact they are quite simply better at the moment. It's not like their populations have grown by tens of millions in the last few years.
True. If it all came down to biggest populations India (for example) would be way better at the Olympics across all disciplines. Culture and intellect play a big part of sporting success.
......yeah I had a good chat with an Indian dude I know about this very thing and he bemoaned the fact that his nation was so unathletic overall. They're always last in the medal to population table at the Olympics ! and even in Cricket they're not as dominant as they would hope to be......
Regardless of population you can only have 15 guys on the field at once. New Zealand just isn't producing generational talent ( aside from maybe Jordan or Roigard ) like they have in the past.
The coaching isn't helping either.
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@nonpartizan said in All Blacks 2025:
@MN5 said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan said in All Blacks 2025:
@sparky said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan New Zealand used to have extra rugby smarts to make up for lower player numbers than England, South Africa and France. Not any more.
I expect those three nations with their huge resources to pull away in the next few years.
I think small countries can compete with bigger countries in sport - such as how Jamaica is consistently the biggest rival to the US in sprinting despite having a population of only 3 million.
HOWEVER, what you can't afford is waste and inefficiency. Your decision making at all levels of the game have to be very accurate. You need the smartest people in charge making the decisions so that you are always able to use your resources wisely. One bad appointment or poor decision can cripple you. I would say in that sense the AB hiring process for a coach has to be unbelievably thorough next time around. The vetting needs to be through the roof.
I think the Black Caps well and truly dismissed that "small country vs big country" nonsense with their 3-0 victory over India ( population over a billion ) IN INDIA......and of those billion people a fair few of them are into Cricket.
Trotting out the "SA and France have bigger populations" is just not facing up to the fact they are quite simply better at the moment. It's not like their populations have grown by tens of millions in the last few years.
True. If it all came down to biggest populations India (for example) would be way better at the Olympics across all disciplines. Culture and intellect play a big part of sporting success.
I don't think intellect has a lot to do with it. David Beckham ain't no genius but boy could he bend that ball.
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@nonpartizan said in All Blacks 2025:
@sparky said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan New Zealand used to have extra rugby smarts to make up for lower player numbers than England, South Africa and France. Not any more.
I expect those three nations with their huge resources to pull away in the next few years.
I think small countries can compete with bigger countries in sport - such as how Jamaica is consistently the biggest rival to the US in sprinting despite having a population of only 3 million.
HOWEVER, what you can't afford is waste and inefficiency. Your decision making at all levels of the game have to be very accurate. You need the smartest people in charge making the decisions so that you are always able to use your resources wisely. One bad appointment or poor decision can cripple you. I would say in that sense the AB hiring process for a coach has to be unbelievably thorough next time around. The candidates need to be thoroughly vetted and whatever their weaknesses are there has to be some steps taken to offset them.
Agree waste is a big problem and I can't understand why Jason Ryan gets such a big pass for it. He is the one coach in the setup who has made it obvious he is still stuck in the past where the All Blacks could afford to exclude players with tremendous talent on attitudinal grounds and select players who are not up to it because they have the right attitude.
He is the dumb motherfucker who has excluded 3 of the loose forwards with the most potential talent of their generation in Akira Ioane, Hoskin Sotutu and Dalton Papali'i. Not saying every one of these players would have been a success but a good coach should back himself to get the best out of at least 2 of them. All Black rugby can simply not afford to waste this kind of talent anymore.
He is also the dumb motherfucker who has selected guys not good enough for test rugby like Brodie McCallister, George Bell, Luke Jacobson, Du'Plessis Kirifi while putting to much faith in players like players like Wallace Sititi to be world beaters on the basis of a few Ardie Savea like highlights. Savea is also shit as a 7 and a starter in general and should be on the bench which I put partly on Jason Ryan as well.
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@nonpartizan said in All Blacks 2025:
think small countries can compete with bigger countries in sport - such as how Jamaica is consistently the biggest rival to the US in sprinting despite having a population of only 3 million.
Jamaica: probably drugs
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@nzzp said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan said in All Blacks 2025:
think small countries can compete with bigger countries in sport - such as how Jamaica is consistently the biggest rival to the US in sprinting despite having a population of only 3 million.
Jamaica: probably drugs
All those top athletes are on the juice. Jamaica has really good structures and coaching too for athletics. It's their number one sport.
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@nzzp said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan said in All Blacks 2025:
think small countries can compete with bigger countries in sport - such as how Jamaica is consistently the biggest rival to the US in sprinting despite having a population of only 3 million.
Jamaica: probably drugs
NZ should invest in better drugs then
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@akan004 said in All Blacks 2025:
I don't think this is true anymore. How many ABs would make a World XV atm? Possibly only Roigard and even that's highly debatable with Dupont around. Can't think of anyone else.
If Roigard plays to the level of yesterday I'm not sure Dupont is clearly ahead.
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@brodean said in All Blacks 2025:
Holland should be the first lock named and the main 80 minute player. Vaa'i can lose focus if he plays much longer than 60. Paddy, Scooter and Darry can fill in the gaps when they're not injured. I doubt any of those 3 have the bodies now for regular 80 minute test rugby
eh? What happened to Darry's conditioning? Has he picked up a longterm injury?
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So now that we’ve most likely lost the Rugby Championship, can we start Ruben Love at 10 next week and see what he can do.
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Also would like to see how Jordie would go at 13. Gives opportunities for guys like Quinn, Leicester (available??) and Jim (injured) to have a start at 12.
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@tubbyj said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan said in All Blacks 2025:
@sparky said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan New Zealand used to have extra rugby smarts to make up for lower player numbers than England, South Africa and France. Not any more.
I expect those three nations with their huge resources to pull away in the next few years.
I think small countries can compete with bigger countries in sport - such as how Jamaica is consistently the biggest rival to the US in sprinting despite having a population of only 3 million.
HOWEVER, what you can't afford is waste and inefficiency. Your decision making at all levels of the game have to be very accurate. You need the smartest people in charge making the decisions so that you are always able to use your resources wisely. One bad appointment or poor decision can cripple you. I would say in that sense the AB hiring process for a coach has to be unbelievably thorough next time around. The candidates need to be thoroughly vetted and whatever their weaknesses are there has to be some steps taken to offset them.
Agree waste is a big problem and I can't understand why Jason Ryan gets such a big pass for it. He is the one coach in the setup who has made it obvious he is still stuck in the past where the All Blacks could afford to exclude players with tremendous talent on attitudinal grounds and select players who are not up to it because they have the right attitude.
He is the dumb motherfucker who has excluded 3 of the loose forwards with the most potential talent of their generation in Akira Ioane, Hoskin Sotutu and Dalton Papali'i. Not saying every one of these players would have been a success but a good coach should back himself to get the best out of at least 2 of them. All Black rugby can simply not afford to waste this kind of talent anymore.
He is also the dumb motherfucker who has selected guys not good enough for test rugby like Brodie McCallister, George Bell, Luke Jacobson, Du'Plessis Kirifi while putting to much faith in players like players like Wallace Sititi to be world beaters on the basis of a few Ardie Savea like highlights. Savea is also shit as a 7 and a starter in general and should be on the bench which I put partly on Jason Ryan as well.
I wouldn't put this guy in with those guys but agree with a lot of the rest.
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@tubbyj said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan said in All Blacks 2025:
@sparky said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan New Zealand used to have extra rugby smarts to make up for lower player numbers than England, South Africa and France. Not any more.
I expect those three nations with their huge resources to pull away in the next few years.
I think small countries can compete with bigger countries in sport - such as how Jamaica is consistently the biggest rival to the US in sprinting despite having a population of only 3 million.
HOWEVER, what you can't afford is waste and inefficiency. Your decision making at all levels of the game have to be very accurate. You need the smartest people in charge making the decisions so that you are always able to use your resources wisely. One bad appointment or poor decision can cripple you. I would say in that sense the AB hiring process for a coach has to be unbelievably thorough next time around. The candidates need to be thoroughly vetted and whatever their weaknesses are there has to be some steps taken to offset them.
Agree waste is a big problem and I can't understand why Jason Ryan gets such a big pass for it. He is the one coach in the setup who has made it obvious he is still stuck in the past where the All Blacks could afford to exclude players with tremendous talent on attitudinal grounds and select players who are not up to it because they have the right attitude.
He is the dumb motherfucker who has excluded 3 of the loose forwards with the most potential talent of their generation in Akira Ioane, Hoskin Sotutu and Dalton Papali'i. Not saying every one of these players would have been a success but a good coach should back himself to get the best out of at least 2 of them. All Black rugby can simply not afford to waste this kind of talent anymore.
He is also the dumb motherfucker who has selected guys not good enough for test rugby like Brodie McCallister, George Bell, Luke Jacobson, Du'Plessis Kirifi while putting to much faith in players like players like Wallace Sititi to be world beaters on the basis of a few Ardie Savea like highlights. Savea is also shit as a 7 and a starter in general and should be on the bench which I put partly on Jason Ryan as well.
Not that I disagree with the central premise of your rant, but my understanding is Razor himself selects the loose forwards.
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@nzzp said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan said in All Blacks 2025:
think small countries can compete with bigger countries in sport - such as how Jamaica is consistently the biggest rival to the US in sprinting despite having a population of only 3 million.
Jamaica: probably drugs
Definitely drugs.
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@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2025:
@brodean said in All Blacks 2025:
Holland should be the first lock named and the main 80 minute player. Vaa'i can lose focus if he plays much longer than 60. Paddy, Scooter and Darry can fill in the gaps when they're not injured. I doubt any of those 3 have the bodies now for regular 80 minute test rugby
eh? What happened to Darry's conditioning? Has he picked up a longterm injury?
He gets injured every year. Hes basically the same age as Vaa'i but played half the Super games.
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@nzzp said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan said in All Blacks 2025:
think small countries can compete with bigger countries in sport - such as how Jamaica is consistently the biggest rival to the US in sprinting despite having a population of only 3 million.
Jamaica: probably drugs
Waaay off topic but I love how basically every Jamaican sprinter was found to be doping except for Usain Bolt. Quite the coincidence that the guy that is by far the best is the only one not doping eh.
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@tubbyj said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan said in All Blacks 2025:
@sparky said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan New Zealand used to have extra rugby smarts to make up for lower player numbers than England, South Africa and France. Not any more.
I expect those three nations with their huge resources to pull away in the next few years.
I think small countries can compete with bigger countries in sport - such as how Jamaica is consistently the biggest rival to the US in sprinting despite having a population of only 3 million.
HOWEVER, what you can't afford is waste and inefficiency. Your decision making at all levels of the game have to be very accurate. You need the smartest people in charge making the decisions so that you are always able to use your resources wisely. One bad appointment or poor decision can cripple you. I would say in that sense the AB hiring process for a coach has to be unbelievably thorough next time around. The candidates need to be thoroughly vetted and whatever their weaknesses are there has to be some steps taken to offset them.
Agree waste is a big problem and I can't understand why Jason Ryan gets such a big pass for it. He is the one coach in the setup who has made it obvious he is still stuck in the past where the All Blacks could afford to exclude players with tremendous talent on attitudinal grounds and select players who are not up to it because they have the right attitude.
He is the dumb motherfucker who has excluded 3 of the loose forwards with the most potential talent of their generation in Akira Ioane, Hoskin Sotutu and Dalton Papali'i. Not saying every one of these players would have been a success but a good coach should back himself to get the best out of at least 2 of them. All Black rugby can simply not afford to waste this kind of talent anymore.
He is also the dumb motherfucker who has selected guys not good enough for test rugby like Brodie McCallister, George Bell, Luke Jacobson, Du'Plessis Kirifi while putting to much faith in players like players like Wallace Sititi to be world beaters on the basis of a few Ardie Savea like highlights. Savea is also shit as a 7 and a starter in general and should be on the bench which I put partly on Jason Ryan as well.
100% this, we are absolutely killing ourselves with awful coaches who make awful selections despite some of the best coaches in the game being NZers.
I am also starting to understand why NZR decided to renew Henry after 07 instead of appointing Deans who had a similar record to Razor at Super level. We can't afford any provincial bias weakening us, that's what we have right now and it's destroying the team from the inside out.
I am 100% serious that I want this entire coaching group moved on right now, with an interim coach appointed while we try to assemble a professional team. It's an embarrassment that we have coaches that have "personal beef" with fucking 20 year old players so they just refuse to even select them, despite them being the best we have. Can you imagine Henry having "personal beef" with any players? Not in a million years, if he thought a talented player had a shit attitude he'd work with them to get the best out of them - THAT IS WHAT THE COACH IS MEANT TO DO!
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@No-Quarter said in All Blacks 2025:
@tubbyj said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan said in All Blacks 2025:
@sparky said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan New Zealand used to have extra rugby smarts to make up for lower player numbers than England, South Africa and France. Not any more.
I expect those three nations with their huge resources to pull away in the next few years.
I think small countries can compete with bigger countries in sport - such as how Jamaica is consistently the biggest rival to the US in sprinting despite having a population of only 3 million.
HOWEVER, what you can't afford is waste and inefficiency. Your decision making at all levels of the game have to be very accurate. You need the smartest people in charge making the decisions so that you are always able to use your resources wisely. One bad appointment or poor decision can cripple you. I would say in that sense the AB hiring process for a coach has to be unbelievably thorough next time around. The candidates need to be thoroughly vetted and whatever their weaknesses are there has to be some steps taken to offset them.
Agree waste is a big problem and I can't understand why Jason Ryan gets such a big pass for it. He is the one coach in the setup who has made it obvious he is still stuck in the past where the All Blacks could afford to exclude players with tremendous talent on attitudinal grounds and select players who are not up to it because they have the right attitude.
He is the dumb motherfucker who has excluded 3 of the loose forwards with the most potential talent of their generation in Akira Ioane, Hoskin Sotutu and Dalton Papali'i. Not saying every one of these players would have been a success but a good coach should back himself to get the best out of at least 2 of them. All Black rugby can simply not afford to waste this kind of talent anymore.
He is also the dumb motherfucker who has selected guys not good enough for test rugby like Brodie McCallister, George Bell, Luke Jacobson, Du'Plessis Kirifi while putting to much faith in players like players like Wallace Sititi to be world beaters on the basis of a few Ardie Savea like highlights. Savea is also shit as a 7 and a starter in general and should be on the bench which I put partly on Jason Ryan as well.
100% this, we are absolutely killing ourselves with awful coaches who make awful selections despite some of the best coaches in the game being NZers.
I am also starting to understand why NZR decided to renew Henry after 07 instead of appointing Deans who had a similar record to Razor at Super level. We can't afford any provincial bias weakening us, that's what we have right now and it's destroying the team from the inside out.
I am 100% serious that I want this entire coaching group moved on right now, with an interim coach appointed while we try to assemble a professional team. It's an embarrassment that we have coaches that have "personal beef" with fucking 20 year old players so they just refuse to even select them, despite them being the best we have. Can you imagine Henry having "personal beef" with any players? Not in a million years, if he thought a talented player had a shit attitude he'd work with them to get the best out of them - THAT IS WHAT THE COACH IS MEANT TO DO!
Amen to that, you can't let emotion and ego get in the way of your job. What Steve Hansen did to try and offset any bias or poor judgment on selections was make a Foxy a selector. He said he wanted someone involved in selection who has no relationship with the players who was impartial and not emotionally connected.
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One last thing about this test match - one thing I have not figured out is how the coaches are using Proctor or what his role is....
In the sense that as I posted last week he was the only back not involved in the try in Wellington when 12 players were involved in the build up.
Caleb Clarkes try last night he was a decoy and quite a few other times he is either skipped or players take it into contact instead of passing to him. I'm not sure what role the coaches have envisioned for him because its like he is a complete afterthought on attack.
Quinn Tupaea was way more involved/central in the AB attack last night in just a short cameo off the bench and out of position on the wing.
