All Blacks 2025
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One last thing about this test match - one thing I have not figured out is how the coaches are using Proctor or what his role is....
In the sense that as I posted last week he was the only back not involved in the try in Wellington when 12 players were involved in the build up.
Caleb Clarkes try last night he was a decoy and quite a few other times he is either skipped or players take it into contact instead of passing to him. I'm not sure what role the coaches have envisioned for him because its like he is a complete afterthought on attack.
Quinn Tupaea was way more involved/central in the AB attack last night in just a short cameo off the bench and out of position on the wing.
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@nonpartizan said in All Blacks 2025:
@No-Quarter said in All Blacks 2025:
@tubbyj said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan said in All Blacks 2025:
@sparky said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan New Zealand used to have extra rugby smarts to make up for lower player numbers than England, South Africa and France. Not any more.
I expect those three nations with their huge resources to pull away in the next few years.
I think small countries can compete with bigger countries in sport - such as how Jamaica is consistently the biggest rival to the US in sprinting despite having a population of only 3 million.
HOWEVER, what you can't afford is waste and inefficiency. Your decision making at all levels of the game have to be very accurate. You need the smartest people in charge making the decisions so that you are always able to use your resources wisely. One bad appointment or poor decision can cripple you. I would say in that sense the AB hiring process for a coach has to be unbelievably thorough next time around. The candidates need to be thoroughly vetted and whatever their weaknesses are there has to be some steps taken to offset them.
Agree waste is a big problem and I can't understand why Jason Ryan gets such a big pass for it. He is the one coach in the setup who has made it obvious he is still stuck in the past where the All Blacks could afford to exclude players with tremendous talent on attitudinal grounds and select players who are not up to it because they have the right attitude.
He is the dumb motherfucker who has excluded 3 of the loose forwards with the most potential talent of their generation in Akira Ioane, Hoskin Sotutu and Dalton Papali'i. Not saying every one of these players would have been a success but a good coach should back himself to get the best out of at least 2 of them. All Black rugby can simply not afford to waste this kind of talent anymore.
He is also the dumb motherfucker who has selected guys not good enough for test rugby like Brodie McCallister, George Bell, Luke Jacobson, Du'Plessis Kirifi while putting to much faith in players like players like Wallace Sititi to be world beaters on the basis of a few Ardie Savea like highlights. Savea is also shit as a 7 and a starter in general and should be on the bench which I put partly on Jason Ryan as well.
100% this, we are absolutely killing ourselves with awful coaches who make awful selections despite some of the best coaches in the game being NZers.
I am also starting to understand why NZR decided to renew Henry after 07 instead of appointing Deans who had a similar record to Razor at Super level. We can't afford any provincial bias weakening us, that's what we have right now and it's destroying the team from the inside out.
I am 100% serious that I want this entire coaching group moved on right now, with an interim coach appointed while we try to assemble a professional team. It's an embarrassment that we have coaches that have "personal beef" with fucking 20 year old players so they just refuse to even select them, despite them being the best we have. Can you imagine Henry having "personal beef" with any players? Not in a million years, if he thought a talented player had a shit attitude he'd work with them to get the best out of them - THAT IS WHAT THE COACH IS MEANT TO DO!
Amen to that, you can't let emotion and ego get in the way of your job. What Steve Hansen did to try and offset any bias or poor judgment on selections was make a Foxy a selector. He said he wanted someone involved in selection who has no relationship with the players who was impartial and not emotionally connected.
On Shag, am I imagining things or did he not want anything to do with Ali Williams but Ted came in and said 'make it work'?
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@African-Monkey said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan said in All Blacks 2025:
@No-Quarter said in All Blacks 2025:
@tubbyj said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan said in All Blacks 2025:
@sparky said in All Blacks 2025:
@nonpartizan New Zealand used to have extra rugby smarts to make up for lower player numbers than England, South Africa and France. Not any more.
I expect those three nations with their huge resources to pull away in the next few years.
I think small countries can compete with bigger countries in sport - such as how Jamaica is consistently the biggest rival to the US in sprinting despite having a population of only 3 million.
HOWEVER, what you can't afford is waste and inefficiency. Your decision making at all levels of the game have to be very accurate. You need the smartest people in charge making the decisions so that you are always able to use your resources wisely. One bad appointment or poor decision can cripple you. I would say in that sense the AB hiring process for a coach has to be unbelievably thorough next time around. The candidates need to be thoroughly vetted and whatever their weaknesses are there has to be some steps taken to offset them.
Agree waste is a big problem and I can't understand why Jason Ryan gets such a big pass for it. He is the one coach in the setup who has made it obvious he is still stuck in the past where the All Blacks could afford to exclude players with tremendous talent on attitudinal grounds and select players who are not up to it because they have the right attitude.
He is the dumb motherfucker who has excluded 3 of the loose forwards with the most potential talent of their generation in Akira Ioane, Hoskin Sotutu and Dalton Papali'i. Not saying every one of these players would have been a success but a good coach should back himself to get the best out of at least 2 of them. All Black rugby can simply not afford to waste this kind of talent anymore.
He is also the dumb motherfucker who has selected guys not good enough for test rugby like Brodie McCallister, George Bell, Luke Jacobson, Du'Plessis Kirifi while putting to much faith in players like players like Wallace Sititi to be world beaters on the basis of a few Ardie Savea like highlights. Savea is also shit as a 7 and a starter in general and should be on the bench which I put partly on Jason Ryan as well.
100% this, we are absolutely killing ourselves with awful coaches who make awful selections despite some of the best coaches in the game being NZers.
I am also starting to understand why NZR decided to renew Henry after 07 instead of appointing Deans who had a similar record to Razor at Super level. We can't afford any provincial bias weakening us, that's what we have right now and it's destroying the team from the inside out.
I am 100% serious that I want this entire coaching group moved on right now, with an interim coach appointed while we try to assemble a professional team. It's an embarrassment that we have coaches that have "personal beef" with fucking 20 year old players so they just refuse to even select them, despite them being the best we have. Can you imagine Henry having "personal beef" with any players? Not in a million years, if he thought a talented player had a shit attitude he'd work with them to get the best out of them - THAT IS WHAT THE COACH IS MEANT TO DO!
Amen to that, you can't let emotion and ego get in the way of your job. What Steve Hansen did to try and offset any bias or poor judgment on selections was make a Foxy a selector. He said he wanted someone involved in selection who has no relationship with the players who was impartial and not emotionally connected.
On Shag, am I imagining things or did he not want anything to do with Ali Williams but Ted came in and said 'make it work'?
Yes, I think that was the case. He definitely had a problem with how Ali carried himself in public and told him such but they worked through it.
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@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2025:
@akan004 said in All Blacks 2025:
I don't think this is true anymore. How many ABs would make a World XV atm? Possibly only Roigard and even that's highly debatable with Dupont around. Can't think of anyone else.
If Roigard plays to the level of yesterday I'm not sure Dupont is clearly ahead.
I’d take Reinach at the moment
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So Beaudie and EdG ruled out for Perth, we will at least see some changes for the starting lineup and bench.
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@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks 2025:
So Beaudie and EdG ruled out for Perth, we will at least see some changes for the starting lineup and bench.
Jordie Barrett as 10 cover or someone else comes in?
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Just rewatched the game. The ABs look so rigid. They just don't look comfortable, at least 2 times there's a clear overlap with the line begging but the outside man is ignored. There's no confidence to make the pass. God knows how you fix that.
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@ExiledHalfback said in All Blacks 2025:
Just rewatched the game. The ABs look so rigid. They just don't look comfortable, at least 2 times there's a clear overlap with the line begging but the outside man is ignored. There's no confidence to make the pass. God knows how you fix that.
Overcoached? At times they looked like a bunch of guys walking through backline moves for the first time
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Does anyone seriously believe the ABs have a chance next week in Perth, given what we saw at Eden Park in Bledisloe I and given the Wallabies will have Valetini and Skelton back? It seems virtually certain the win/lose cycle will continue.
I’m sure I’m not alone in feeling exasperated at the mediocrity of the selection policies and coaching quality of this regime under Scott Robertson. While the team last night had a few good moments, particularly in the first quarter, a lot of that was on the Wallabies’ passive defence. And of course, the ABs got a HUGE hand-up from the incompetent Italian ref in the second half.
With two seasons into Robertson’s rocky reign and one test to go before the Northern Hemisphere tour (who’s feeling nervous about Scotland and Wales?), the ABs still lack cohesion and confidence, while showing no sign they know what game they are trying to play.
Sure, they were better under the high ball at Eden Park and their set-piece was solid, but after the debacle in Wellington against the Boks, they needed to show more than basic competence. There was no fire or energy or focus there. They looked, yet again, like an ADHD teen on PlayStation , doing just enough to win the next round before they go back to the fridge.
A few weeks back, we were enthusing over the embarrassment of front row riches. Now, Lomax looks busted, Williams has still to fire, and we pray that Taylor doesn’t get injured again because after him, nobody can throw straight. As for the loose forwards, the constant chopping and changing there epitomises the lack of coherence or vision in the coaching. It was only a few weeks are go we were saying, ‘yes the backline is crap but at least Ryan has the forwards firing.’ But who can say that with any confidence at this point?
This team is mediocre, relying on its stars, and should have easily put away a Wallaby outfit missing several first choice players in Valetini, Skelton, Lolesio, Wright, and Kellaway. Thank heavens for Roigard last night, though what are the odds on the keystone cops in the coaching panel coaching him out of form as well?
The Wallabies are ranked, what, number six in the world? They have more than their own quota of journeymen. But they play with so much more confidence, intent and self-belief. The difference between them and the ABs is the coaching. Surely, the NZR can see that by now??
I don’t see what changes from here unless there is a clearout of the clueless and incoherent showpony Robertson and his mediocre, yes-man mates. As someone observed last night, the Bledisloe I ‘victory’ just represented a sticking plaster being placed over a gaping wound.
It could get really ugly in Perth.
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@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks 2025:
So Beaudie and EdG ruled out for Perth, we will at least see some changes for the starting lineup and bench.
Good chance for Norris to get some more minutes - like what I've seen this year.
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2025:
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks 2025:
So Beaudie and EdG ruled out for Perth, we will at least see some changes for the starting lineup and bench.
Good chance for Norris to get some more minutes - like what I've seen this year.
And DMac. Maybe even Love will get some minutes
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There were moments last night when we looked good. I enjoyed the Clarke try and Roigard's first, not because we did anything fancy, but because they came off the back of waves of attack up the guts. When we did all the over complicated back line stuff more often than not we either stuffed it up or we got smashed behind the gain line.
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@ExiledHalfback said in All Blacks 2025:
Just rewatched the game. The ABs look so rigid. They just don't look comfortable, at least 2 times there's a clear overlap with the line begging but the outside man is ignored. There's no confidence to make the pass. God knows how you fix that.
I saw that too. Was it Roigard who went for the line instead of passing on one ocassion?
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
@ExiledHalfback said in All Blacks 2025:
Just rewatched the game. The ABs look so rigid. They just don't look comfortable, at least 2 times there's a clear overlap with the line begging but the outside man is ignored. There's no confidence to make the pass. God knows how you fix that.
I saw that too. Was it Roigard who went for the line instead of passing on one ocassion?
Well he did score on one occasion doing that...
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@sparky said in All Blacks 2025:
The Team I'd select for Perth
- Williams
- Taylor (c)
- Newell
- Holland
- Tuipulotu
- Parker
- Lakai
- Sititi
- Roigard
- Love
- Clarke
- Tupaea
- J. Barrett
- L. Carter
- W. Jordan
- S. Taukei'aho
- O. Norris
- T. Lomax
- T. Vaa'i
- A. Savea
- C. Ratima
- D. McKenzie
- L. Fainga'anuku
I'm starting DMac. He's finally going to get a deserved start. But I want to see Love get some serious game time. If we get ahead enough he could have a crack at 10
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Can’t fathom why they’re not taking cover for 10 with no BB.
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2025:
Good chance for Norris to get some more minutes - like what I've seen this year.
Is Norris going to Perth? He was listed as having a back injury so it's likely Bower makes the bench.
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@canefan said in All Blacks 2025:
@sparky said in All Blacks 2025:
The Team I'd select for Perth
- Williams
- Taylor (c)
- Newell
- Holland
- Tuipulotu
- Parker
- Lakai
- Sititi
- Roigard
- Love
- Clarke
- Tupaea
- J. Barrett
- L. Carter
- W. Jordan
- S. Taukei'aho
- O. Norris
- T. Lomax
- T. Vaa'i
- A. Savea
- C. Ratima
- D. McKenzie
- L. Fainga'anuku
I'm starting DMac. He's finally going to get a deserved start. But I want to see Love get some serious game time. If we get ahead enough he could have a crack at 10
Agree no way I can feel that love should leap over DMac at 10. Bench place absolutely
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@ExiledHalfback said in All Blacks 2025:
Just rewatched the game. The ABs look so rigid. They just don't look comfortable, at least 2 times there's a clear overlap with the line begging but the outside man is ignored. There's no confidence to make the pass. God knows how you fix that.
At the game that did my fucking head in. For Roigards first, we had 1 wallaby player defending half the field and 3 ABs for 3 phases and we never shifted it once.
There was one in the 2nd half and Proctor tightened his position rather than stretching the field.
We used to be the masters of eyes up footy
