All Blacks 2025
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@frugby said in All Blacks 2025:
@gt12 The flip argument is he is getting no game time because he has been poor - which begs the question, why haven't they tried someone else?
Good question, but (1) will another player get game time and (2) are they in the group of favourites who get a run?
This coaching team is very reliant on a small number of the squad and doesn't seem happy using their bench in any sort of innovative way.
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@No-Quarter said in All Blacks 2025:
@Crazy-Horse said in All Blacks 2025:
For what it's worth, Razor's press conferences were pretty dire for the Saders too, but that got over looked because he was winning. He really struggles to articulate. I wonder what he is like when addressing the players?
I heard he uses pictures of dogs barking at sheep to get his point across
In Whitelock's book.
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My guess is that the coaches have tried to shift a lot of the playmaking responsibilities away from 10 over the past 12 months and asked for the halfback to be more a general than just a feeder.
Ratima actually looked very good when he was just quickly getting the ball out in those final few minutes. He looked incredibly ponderous for the rest of his time in the field (and was similar towards the end of last year).
The interesting thing is that Roigard isn't actually any quicker with his ball delivery but he makes up for it with an incredible kicking game. You take that kicking game out of the equation and he didn't really cover himself in glory against England either - but it's such a key part of an NZ 9s role now because the guy selected at 10 has an awful kicking game and can't seem to run a backline, and the All Black look so insipid on attack which requires more from the halfback (potentially another product of the 10).
All of which is to say that Ratima is not a good option at the moment, not with the way the team plays and what they need out of a 9.
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@kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks 2025:
@Crazy-Horse said in All Blacks 2025:
@Jet said in All Blacks 2025:
Devlin gone off on them.
I don't get Devlin's call for the assistant coaches to get sacked but keep Razor in his job, a call that has been made on here by some as well. Razor is the boss, the buck stops with him.
Probably because Fozzie was afforded that , he thinks that’s the acceptable way of changing things up without going the full sacking
Foster never got the assistants he wanted from the start though, and we saw improvements once he did. Hopefully Robertson got the assistants he wanted after the Foster debacle - but you never know with NZR......
NZR have created a real coaching mess in the last 2-3 years and right now Robertson looks out of his depth at Test level but putting someone experienced like Cotter in the mix with authority might help.
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@frugby said in All Blacks 2025:
Money aside, I think this is a little different to Foster. Possibly easier to just sweep house then trying to make this regime work.
Sure is different. We don't just play dumb rugby - now we just give up.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
putting someone experienced like Cotter in the mix with authority might help.
Might even have the temerity to tell Savea to hit a fucking ruck.
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@Tim said in All Blacks 2025:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:
putting someone experienced like Cotter in the mix with authority might help.
Might even have the temerity to tell Savea to hit a fucking ruck.
Good luck with that. He'll probably pack his bags and move to Japan/R360 permanently with all his dickrider fans and media showing their solidarity towards him.
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@sparky said in All Blacks 2025:
@Jet 09:30 in and Devlin drops another truth bomb. Two years in and who has Robertson coached to be a better player?
Maybe Fabian Holland, Tupou Vaii, Josh Lord and Peter Lakai but it's not a long list.
Just picking on Holland as he is the guy I have followed the closest. He has been the best forward in every team he has played in. Not the ABs best, a clear standout at this stage. Has just been a constant improver. Not a player Roberston can take credit for. He would habe picked him last year, just wasn't eligible. He has done well out of the NZ system. Just an amazing athlete.
The dominance of the Chiefs and the Crusaders is an issue. Average players who wouldn't stand out for others get carried into the national side. While guys who could benefit from game time don't get the time they need to show their skills. We need to have better talent distribution in NZ rugby. At full strength the Crusaders will have an AB XV midfielder holding tackle bags. The Chiefs will have a nationally ranked six playing club rugby. Apparently our best six in NZ is primarily a lock.
If Kaylum Boshier is on the national radar will he see much footy at the Chiefs. The same with Dallas McLeod or Braydon Ennor.
We are in a luxurious position where our national body pulls the strings. Yet, most weeks we have guys on the radar in the stands.
There is no alignment between national and our premier competition.
The only position where we have a really good spread is halfback. Where there are premier halfbacks at every franchise.
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@SouthernMann said in All Blacks 2025:
@sparky said in All Blacks 2025:
@Jet 09:30 in and Devlin drops another truth bomb. Two years in and who has Robertson coached to be a better player?
Maybe Fabian Holland, Tupou Vaii, Josh Lord and Peter Lakai but it's not a long list.
Just picking on Holland as he is the guy I have followed the closest. He has been the best forward in every team he has played in. Not the ABs best, a clear standout at this stage. Has just been a constant improver. Not a player Roberston can take credit for. He would habe picked him last year, just wasn't eligible. He has done well out of the NZ system. Just an amazing athlete.
The dominance of the Chiefs and the Crusaders is an issue. Average players who wouldn't stand out for others get carried into the national side. While guys who could benefit from game time don't get the time they need to show their skills. We need to have better talent distribution in NZ rugby. At full strength the Crusaders will have an AB XV midfielder holding tackle bags. The Chiefs will have a nationally ranked six playing club rugby. Apparently our best six in NZ is primarily a lock.
If Kaylum Boshier is on the national radar will he see much footy at the Chiefs. The same with Dallas McLeod or Braydon Ennor.
We are in a luxurious position where our national body pulls the strings. Yet, most weeks we have guys on the radar in the stands.
There is no alignment between national and our premier competition.
The only position where we have a really good spread is halfback. Where there are premier halfbacks at every franchise.
Agree re Holland.
The fact that a guy like Lucas Casey cant get a full Super Rugby contract while Boshier is getting picked for ABs XV is insanity. The whole NZ rugby system is screwed at the moment.
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@brodean said in All Blacks 2025:
@SouthernMann said in All Blacks 2025:
@sparky said in All Blacks 2025:
@Jet 09:30 in and Devlin drops another truth bomb. Two years in and who has Robertson coached to be a better player?
Maybe Fabian Holland, Tupou Vaii, Josh Lord and Peter Lakai but it's not a long list.
Just picking on Holland as he is the guy I have followed the closest. He has been the best forward in every team he has played in. Not the ABs best, a clear standout at this stage. Has just been a constant improver. Not a player Roberston can take credit for. He would habe picked him last year, just wasn't eligible. He has done well out of the NZ system. Just an amazing athlete.
The dominance of the Chiefs and the Crusaders is an issue. Average players who wouldn't stand out for others get carried into the national side. While guys who could benefit from game time don't get the time they need to show their skills. We need to have better talent distribution in NZ rugby. At full strength the Crusaders will have an AB XV midfielder holding tackle bags. The Chiefs will have a nationally ranked six playing club rugby. Apparently our best six in NZ is primarily a lock.
If Kaylum Boshier is on the national radar will he see much footy at the Chiefs. The same with Dallas McLeod or Braydon Ennor.
We are in a luxurious position where our national body pulls the strings. Yet, most weeks we have guys on the radar in the stands.
There is no alignment between national and our premier competition.
The only position where we have a really good spread is halfback. Where there are premier halfbacks at every franchise.
Agree re Holland.
The fact that a guy like Lucas Casey cant get a full Super Rugby contract while Boshier is getting picked for ABs XV is insanity. The whole NZ rugby system is screwed at the moment.
The thing with Casey is he is a perfect potential no 20. A guy who can lift intensity. It is a problem and a benefit of the divide between NPC and Super. He also reflects the conservative nature of Super Rugby selections and identification. He was somewhat of a late bloomer. Even from watching Dunedin club rugby highlights from another city it was easy to identify him as the premier player. Yet, going down for the last game Harry Taylor was in Landers kit as a training player. Joseph and his coaching staff should have flagged Caeey and involved this year.
The balance between Super and NPC still needs to be ironed out. Which is another topic. The problem from a high performance perspective is Joseph can't pick a guy like Casey for the ABXV when he doesn’t have him initially available for HIS Super side.
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So where does Robertson go from here? The positives were the lineout, the form of Taylor and Roigard, and the development of Holland and Lord. Very little else.
Defence, scrum, high ball, kicking game, ruck work, ball carrying, midfield all massive concerns. Scrum, high ball, ruck, defence could be helped by specialist coaches, but need better selections too. Ellison is fucking shithouse and needs to go ASAP. We don't have a specialist scrum coach, IIRC.
Does Robertson go back to what he knows best and double down on Crusaders players? He will have his great hope, Mounga, returning ...
Looks very bleak to me.
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@Tim My guess is that the only way Robertson survives is to throw most his assistants and senior players under the bus so that's what he'll try.
I don't see him as the type who will quit so I guess he'll send for ROG, Wayne Smith and Jamie Joseph, then try to find a new captain next year.
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@Tim said in All Blacks 2025:
So where does Robertson go from here? The positives were the lineout, the form of Taylor and Roigard, and the development of Holland and Lord. Very little else.
Defence, scrum, high ball, kicking game, ruck work, ball carrying, midfield all massive concerns. Scrum, high ball, ruck, defence could be helped by specialist coaches, but need better selections too. Ellison is fucking shithouse and needs to go ASAP. We don't have a specialist scrum coach, IIRC.
Does Robertson go back to what he knows best and double down on Crusaders players? He will have his great hope, Mounga, returning ...
Looks very bleak to me.
I agree with all that but compared with Fosters era we do have a forward pack that can compete with anyone.
Not having Lomax, Holland, Vaai and Roigard's injury hindered us a bit this time and the leadership / game plan was shit. -
I'm waiting for this cycle to end tbh. I can't see any improvement going into next year and yeah, we may go on a run in the RWC as sometimes not the best teams can go far in that tournament, but it's been a disappointing 2 years by our standards, similar to the last cycle, but funnily enough, towards the end of that last cycle, I did see some improvement.
Seeing the back of Savea, the Barrett's (well, 2 of them at least), the other squad members that have been around forever that are still around the squad, and this coaching staff and being able to start fresh hopefully will be nice from 2028 onwards where we don't have senior players well past their best holding the jersey hostage.
We do have the cattle, there's no doubt about that, but we either aren't seeing it, or the coaches aren't getting the best out of it.
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@Tim said in All Blacks 2025:
Man, I really would prefer Plummer over Barrett at the Blues next season.
I still don't know why Cotter gave the team back to BB after Plummer won him the title the year before. BB is kissed on the cosk so much but is so undeserving now days
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Eventually, sport gives you the truth. One of few things in life that does. For me the biggest storyline from 2025, barring a defeat next week, will be France bringing their C team. Had they brought their lunch, the truth would have surfaced much earlier.
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“Congratulations Beauden Barrett on your 200th test, especially in this important 2028 Rugby Championship clash against the Springboks.”
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@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks 2025:
“Congratulations Beauden Barrett on your 200th test, especially in this important 2028 Rugby Championship clash against the Springboks.”
Don't give them ideas, they're probably reading.
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https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/360887652/where-did-it-all-go-wrong-all-blacks-against-england-london
All Blacks coach Scott Robertson is certain to make changes for the test against Wales, but you would expect he won't tell captain Scott Barrett to take a rest.
Barrett won't have an appetite to return home in the knowledge his most recent appearance for the All Blacks was while giving interviews as the defeated commander in chief.
Robertson, who is contracted to NZ Rugby through to the 2027 World Cup, is likely to be asked tough questions from the board when he returns Down Under.
Things are busy on the home front. There's a whiff of change in the air.
Hmm ... We can only hope that an intelligent chairman gets rid of an idiot coach.
