Foster, Robertson, Rennie etc
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what i mean.. is the talent disparity between the 5 franchises has narrowed in recent times, due to NZR central contracting, etc..
look at the margins of the SR Aotearoa 2020 season, it was the most intense, competitive & evenly matched club league I've watched.
it was such a tough competition that a 4 time grand slam winning coach in Gatland left with an ungodly 0-8 season record....
@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks 2021:
is the talent disparity between the 5 franchises has narrowed in recent times
lol what? The Crusaders have how many current ABs? Go read their thread! they don't know how to get them in the 23, let alone the fucking 15
meanwhile the Chiefs have.....
Some of the teams are closer in talent now, because the talent is less, nearly everywhere. Throw in a couple of sabbaticals, and a season ending injury...
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Every. single. All. Blacks. thread. (and many other rugby threads, too)
It's like every one of them is a grumpy old man thread.
Lighten the f*ck up. Rugby is still a beautiful game worth watching. Yes, some stupid law changes and incompetent officiating can make my blood boil, too, but the game is still awesome.
I think you guys have changed more than the game. Bunch of whingers. :grinning_face:
@stargazer said in All Blacks 2021:
Every. single. All. Blacks. thread. (and many other rugby threads, too)
It's like every one of them is a grumpy old man thread.
Lighten the f*ck up. Rugby is still a beautiful game worth watching. Yes, some stupid law changes and incompetent officiating can make my blood boil, too, but the game is still awesome.
I think you guys have changed more than the game. Bunch of whingers. :grinning_face:
it's a discussion board, not a bulletin board for social media news
if you don't like it...
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@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks 2021:
@kirwan the Super Rugby format changed to conferences in 2016 resulting in a lot more NZ derby fixtures, and I'd argue that between 2016-present the NZ franchises have never been more evenly matched, at present we have 4-5 exceptionally good NZ franchises.
back in Henry-era.. Highlanders, Chiefs were rubbish, Blues were also poor, Hurricanes up & down, Crusaders only consistent NZ side.
Also, your argument also has little because in the last 2 years Razor has been playing solely NZ opposition, in arguably the most competitive & evenly matched club competition in the world - Aaron Smith and other players compared Super Rugby Aotearoa to test-match intensity.
But the SA and Oz teams were competitive. Which is why during that time, when the Saders didn't win it, one of theirs did (Bulls, Reds, Brumbies). It's nice of you to make Kirwan's argument for him.
@gt12 can only looked at the evidence provided, facts are Robertson never lost a match to any SA franchise, home or away, across 4 years...
His record includes winning a Grand final on the highveld, in South Africa, the only side in Super Rugby's 25 season history.
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@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks 2021:
is the talent disparity between the 5 franchises has narrowed in recent times
lol what? The Crusaders have how many current ABs? Go read their thread! they don't know how to get them in the 23, let alone the fucking 15
meanwhile the Chiefs have.....
Some of the teams are closer in talent now, because the talent is less, nearly everywhere. Throw in a couple of sabbaticals, and a season ending injury...
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2021:
@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks 2021:
is the talent disparity between the 5 franchises has narrowed in recent times
lol what? The Crusaders have how many current ABs? Go read their thread! they don't know how to get them in the 23, let alone the fucking 15
meanwhile the Chiefs have.....
Some of the teams are closer in talent now, because the talent is less, nearly everywhere. Throw in a couple of sabbaticals, and a season ending injury...
@mariner4life we only have aaron smith now :cat_face_with_tears_of_joy:
I get what @kiwi_expat is saying though, results arent generally the forgone conclusions they were once, Landers and blues played the SRTT final, Chiefs and saders were top two teams in SSA :man_shrugging_light_skin_tone:
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@gt12 can only looked at the evidence provided, facts are Robertson never lost a match to any SA franchise, home or away, across 4 years...
His record includes winning a Grand final on the highveld, in South Africa, the only side in Super Rugby's 25 season history.
@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks 2021:
@gt12 can only looked at the evidence provided, facts are
... and he did it with a 12 that couldn't be coached to run straight, and a wing who can only run straight!
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@gt12 can only looked at the evidence provided, facts are Robertson never lost a match to any SA franchise, home or away, across 4 years...
His record includes winning a Grand final on the highveld, in South Africa, the only side in Super Rugby's 25 season history.
@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks 2021:
@gt12 can only looked at the evidence provided, facts are Robertson never lost a match to any SA franchise, home or away, across 4 years...
His record includes winning a Grand final on the highveld, in South Africa, the only side to achieve so in the 25 years of Super Rugby.
And as I pointed out, SA and Oz teams have never been worse. You have to factor that into these achievements
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what i mean.. is the talent disparity between the 5 franchises has narrowed in recent times, due to NZR central contracting, etc..
look at the margins of the SR Aotearoa 2020 season, it was the most intense, competitive & evenly matched club league I've watched.
it was such a tough competition that a 4 time grand slam winning coach in Gatland left with an ungodly 0-8 season record....
@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks 2021:
what i mean.. is the talent disparity between the 5 franchises has narrowed in recent times, due to NZR central contracting, etc..
look at the margins of the SR Aotearoa 2020 season, it was the most intense, competitive & evenly matched club league I've watched.
it was such a tough competition that a 4 time grand slam winning coach in Gatland left with an ungodly 0-8 season record....
No one saying it’s not competitive, just that the standard has been dropping consistently.
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@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks 2021:
is the talent disparity between the 5 franchises has narrowed in recent times
lol what? The Crusaders have how many current ABs? Go read their thread! they don't know how to get them in the 23, let alone the fucking 15
meanwhile the Chiefs have.....
Some of the teams are closer in talent now, because the talent is less, nearly everywhere. Throw in a couple of sabbaticals, and a season ending injury...
Lol... Chiefs & Blues have superior talent across multiple positions to Crusaders, including far more talented, individual 'game-breaker' type All Blacks.
In contrast, Crusaders have a lot of solid journeyman-like players (which includes many of their All Blacks..) and are made to look far better than they actually are - thanks to Razor's ability to mold a champion side.
(to the eyes, an extremely cohesive unit, resulting in the team appearing "greater than the sum of the parts")
The Blues had the most raw talent of any NZ franchise in 2021 but Razor's superior team cohesion & coaching cancelled-out the impact of the Blues erroneously talented backline, loose-forwards and propping stocks, on paper.
(Razor's coaching resulting in the team appearing "greater than the sum of the parts"...)
Leon MacDonald took the most talent-laden stacked Blues side to a lowly 3rd in SR Aotearoa this year.
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Lol... Chiefs & Blues have superior talent across multiple positions to Crusaders, including far more talented, individual 'game-breaker' type All Blacks.
In contrast, Crusaders have a lot of solid journeyman-like players (which includes many of their All Blacks..) and are made to look far better than they actually are - thanks to Razor's ability to mold a champion side.
(to the eyes, an extremely cohesive unit, resulting in the team appearing "greater than the sum of the parts")
The Blues had the most raw talent of any NZ franchise in 2021 but Razor's superior team cohesion & coaching cancelled-out the impact of the Blues erroneously talented backline, loose-forwards and propping stocks, on paper.
(Razor's coaching resulting in the team appearing "greater than the sum of the parts"...)
Leon MacDonald took the most talent-laden stacked Blues side to a lowly 3rd in SR Aotearoa this year.
@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks 2021:
Chiefs & Blues have superior talent across multiple positions than the Crusaders, including more influential 'game-breaker' type All Blacks.
In contrast, Crusaders have a lot of solid journeyman-like players (which includes many of their All Blacks..) and are made to look far better than they actually are - thanks to Razor's ability to mold a champion side.
(to the eyes, an extremely cohesive unit, resulting in the team appearing "greater than the sum of the parts")
The Blues had the most raw talent of any NZ franchise in 2021 but Razor's superior team cohesion & coaching cancelled-out the impact of the Blues erroneously talented backline, loose-forwards and propping stocks, on paper.
(to the eyes, an extremely cohesive unit, and coaching resulting in the team appearing "greater than the sum of the parts"...)
Leon MacDonald took the most talent-laden stacked Blues side to a lowly 3rd in SR Aotearoa this year.
Phiff, couldn’t even make the final of the last comp they were in against piss easy teams.
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@gt12 said in All Blacks 2021:
@chris said in All Blacks 2021:
@gt12 said in All Blacks 2021:
@chris said in All Blacks 2021:
@gt12 said in All Blacks 2021:
@chris said in All Blacks 2021:
@kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2021:
@nepia said in All Blacks 2021:
Why are the Cantabs circling the wagons for Razor?
I don’t think there’s anyone here who’d rather have Fozzie than Razor.
i hope you were insinuating i was a saders fan....i want the AB's to poach him so the saders dont have him any more!
Yeah on second thoughts Fuck it Ab's can keep Foster, we will keep Razor and keep winning.
Then I can keep bagging the fuck out of Foster for his next 9 years.That sounds like the Canterbury way.
Will you be supporting the Wallabies when Razor takes over coaching them too? Some of us haven't forgotten that.
You mean like Rennie now coaching them ?
Go find my post when he was appointed.
I can't be fucked.
https://www.forum.thesilverfern.com/topic/3556/all-black-coach-ian-foster/583
https://www.forum.thesilverfern.com/topic/4200/bledisloe-one-wellington-october-11/1082
https://www.forum.thesilverfern.com/topic/1056/aussie-rugby/1887
You did react badly didn't you :face_savoring_food:
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Just thought a certain few posters above me ought to know this... at the very beginning of his coaching career, Razor inherited a Sumner outfit that was rock bottom of the Chch 2nd Division. Within one year he had transformed them from cellar-dwellers to Division champs. And the following seasons he managed to coach them all the way to the top of Div 1.
He's always taken underperforming teams & exceeded expectations, Sumner was the weakest club in Christchurch when he took over.
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Just thought a certain few posters above me ought to know this... at the very beginning of his coaching career, Razor inherited a Sumner outfit that was rock bottom of the Chch 2nd Division. Within one year he had transformed them from cellar-dwellers to Division champs. And the following seasons he managed to coach them all the way to the top of Div 1.
He's always taken underperforming teams & exceeded expectations, Sumner was the weakest club in Christchurch when he took over.
@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks 2021:
Just thought a certain few posters above me ought to know this... at the very beginning of his coaching career, Razor inherited a Sumner outfit that was rock bottom of the Chch 2nd Division. Within one year he had transformed them from cellar-dwellers to Division champs. And the following seasons he managed to coach them all the way to the top of Div 1.
He's always taken underperforming teams & exceeded expectations, Sumner was the weakest club in Christchurch when he took over.
Genuine question, was it the same players or did he attract better players to Sumner?
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Just thought a certain few posters above me ought to know this... at the very beginning of his coaching career, Razor inherited a Sumner outfit that was rock bottom of the Chch 2nd Division. Within one year he had transformed them from cellar-dwellers to Division champs. And the following seasons he managed to coach them all the way to the top of Div 1.
He's always taken underperforming teams & exceeded expectations, Sumner was the weakest club in Christchurch when he took over.
@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks 2021:
Just thought a certain few posters above me ought to know this... at the very beginning of his coaching career, Razor inherited a Sumner outfit that was rock bottom of the Chch 2nd Division. Within one year he had transformed them from cellar-dwellers to Division champs. And the following seasons he managed to coach them all the way to the top of Div 1.
He's always taken underperforming teams & exceeded expectations, Sumner was the weakest club in Christchurch when he took over.
So what you're saying is he's finally running out of luck.
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@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks 2021:
Just thought a certain few posters above me ought to know this... at the very beginning of his coaching career, Razor inherited a Sumner outfit that was rock bottom of the Chch 2nd Division. Within one year he had transformed them from cellar-dwellers to Division champs. And the following seasons he managed to coach them all the way to the top of Div 1.
He's always taken underperforming teams & exceeded expectations, Sumner was the weakest club in Christchurch when he took over.
Genuine question, was it the same players or did he attract better players to Sumner?
This post is deleted! -
I am not a Mark Reason fan at all but he’s gets this article pretty right IMO.
M[link text](link url) https://i.stuff.co.nz/sport/opinion/127007795/mark-reason-ian-foster-turns-all-blacks-wonderland-into-blunderland -
I am not a Mark Reason fan at all but he’s gets this article pretty right IMO.
M[link text](link url) https://i.stuff.co.nz/sport/opinion/127007795/mark-reason-ian-foster-turns-all-blacks-wonderland-into-blunderland@chris he starts with some interesting points...but then has to go all sensational journolist on it
"For a start, it implied that employers can effectively demote an employee for taking paternity leave. It would be hilarious if Mo’unga took the case to an industrial tribunal, although it will clearly never happen. He might even win"
....as if spots on a team are ever guaranteed
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I am not a Mark Reason fan at all but he’s gets this article pretty right IMO.
M[link text](link url) https://i.stuff.co.nz/sport/opinion/127007795/mark-reason-ian-foster-turns-all-blacks-wonderland-into-blunderland@chris said in All Blacks 2021:
I am not a Mark Reason fan at all but he’s gets this article pretty right IMO.
M[link text](link url) https://i.stuff.co.nz/sport/opinion/127007795/mark-reason-ian-foster-turns-all-blacks-wonderland-into-blunderlandHe’s mostly right but a lot of this is utter click bait bollocks
There are plenty of worrying aspects to this whole charade. Barrett came back from Japan saying he wanted his number 10 jersey back. Instead of brusquely telling him that the coach picked the team, Foster lauded his ambition. The likes of Sir Graham Henry would never have so badly undermined their own authority..
Beaudy said he enjoyed and wanted to play ten, not get HIS jersey back. Players stating a preference is good, and correctly a sign of ambition - like Reiko wanting to play centre. Doesn’t mean the coach will choose that.
It appears that John Plumtree is wielding more and more influence with the insertion of the Hurricanes axis of TJ Perenara, Ardie Savea and Beauden Barrett into the 8, 9 and 10 shirts.
More clickbait bullshit, he has no idea
But yeah the wheels are wobbling and have been for years
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@chris he starts with some interesting points...but then has to go all sensational journolist on it
"For a start, it implied that employers can effectively demote an employee for taking paternity leave. It would be hilarious if Mo’unga took the case to an industrial tribunal, although it will clearly never happen. He might even win"
....as if spots on a team are ever guaranteed
@kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2021:
@chris he starts with some interesting points...but then has to go all sensational journolist on it
"For a start, it implied that employers can effectively demote an employee for taking paternity leave. It would be hilarious if Mo’unga took the case to an industrial tribunal, although it will clearly never happen. He might even win"
....as if spots on a team are ever guaranteed
Yeah I don’t agree with all of it that’s why I said he got it pretty right.
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@chris said in All Blacks 2021:
I am not a Mark Reason fan at all but he’s gets this article pretty right IMO.
M[link text](link url) https://i.stuff.co.nz/sport/opinion/127007795/mark-reason-ian-foster-turns-all-blacks-wonderland-into-blunderlandHe’s mostly right but a lot of this is utter click bait bollocks
There are plenty of worrying aspects to this whole charade. Barrett came back from Japan saying he wanted his number 10 jersey back. Instead of brusquely telling him that the coach picked the team, Foster lauded his ambition. The likes of Sir Graham Henry would never have so badly undermined their own authority..
Beaudy said he enjoyed and wanted to play ten, not get HIS jersey back. Players stating a preference is good, and correctly a sign of ambition - like Reiko wanting to play centre. Doesn’t mean the coach will choose that.
It appears that John Plumtree is wielding more and more influence with the insertion of the Hurricanes axis of TJ Perenara, Ardie Savea and Beauden Barrett into the 8, 9 and 10 shirts.
More clickbait bullshit, he has no idea
But yeah the wheels are wobbling and have been for years
@machpants said in All Blacks 2021:
@chris said in All Blacks 2021:
I am not a Mark Reason fan at all but he’s gets this article pretty right IMO.
M[link text](link url) https://i.stuff.co.nz/sport/opinion/127007795/mark-reason-ian-foster-turns-all-blacks-wonderland-into-blunderlandHe’s mostly right but a lot of this is utter click bait bollocks
There are plenty of worrying aspects to this whole charade. Barrett came back from Japan saying he wanted his number 10 jersey back. Instead of brusquely telling him that the coach picked the team, Foster lauded his ambition. The likes of Sir Graham Henry would never have so badly undermined their own authority..
Beaudy said he enjoyed and wanted to play ten, not get HIS jersey back. Players stating a preference is good, and correctly a sign of ambition - like Reiko wanting to play centre. Doesn’t mean the coach will choose that.
It appears that John Plumtree is wielding more and more influence with the insertion of the Hurricanes axis of TJ Perenara, Ardie Savea and Beauden Barrett into the 8, 9 and 10 shirts.
More clickbait bullshit, he has no idea
But yeah the wheels are wobbling and have been for years
Yep that’s the main thing he got right I don’t agree with all of it. But there is some truth in the article.
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@machpants said in All Blacks 2021:
@chris said in All Blacks 2021:
I am not a Mark Reason fan at all but he’s gets this article pretty right IMO.
M[link text](link url) https://i.stuff.co.nz/sport/opinion/127007795/mark-reason-ian-foster-turns-all-blacks-wonderland-into-blunderlandHe’s mostly right but a lot of this is utter click bait bollocks
There are plenty of worrying aspects to this whole charade. Barrett came back from Japan saying he wanted his number 10 jersey back. Instead of brusquely telling him that the coach picked the team, Foster lauded his ambition. The likes of Sir Graham Henry would never have so badly undermined their own authority..
Beaudy said he enjoyed and wanted to play ten, not get HIS jersey back. Players stating a preference is good, and correctly a sign of ambition - like Reiko wanting to play centre. Doesn’t mean the coach will choose that.
It appears that John Plumtree is wielding more and more influence with the insertion of the Hurricanes axis of TJ Perenara, Ardie Savea and Beauden Barrett into the 8, 9 and 10 shirts.
More clickbait bullshit, he has no idea
But yeah the wheels are wobbling and have been for years
Yep that’s the main thing he got right I don’t agree with all of it. But there is some truth in the article.
