All Blacks 2022
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@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2022:
@booboo said in All Blacks 2022:
@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks 2022:
@Daffy-Jaffy said in All Blacks 2022:
NZ and Australia have played each other 8 times since the world cup, 4 of those at Eden Park, with Australia winning 1 out of the 8.
If you were to exclude these match ups both teams would be sitting at around 50%.
Let's just ignore that stats that don't suit our narrative.
Cool. Let's include RWC2019. NZ didn't win every game in their pool, only Japan (beating Scotland and Ireland) and Wales did. Let's add those games to the narrative!
No. Sorry. I've read this post multiple times and it's still not making sense. Please explain?
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@booboo just saying the criteria make Japan look far worse than if RWC included. I am interested in the strength of the home factor
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2022:
@booboo just saying the criteria make Japan look far worse than if RWC included. I am interested in the strength of the home factor
Ok. Almost makes some sense now.
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@Bones said in All Blacks 2022:
@Windows97 as I recall it, BB buggered off on his sabbatical and then went to play musical chairs at the blues. Nothing to do with goal kicking.
Do the stats really show RM is better than DM at goal kicking?
Well prior to his sabbatical he was the starting first 5 and incumbent goalkicker for the All Blacks, not to mention world player of the year.
Now he's no longer the starting first 5 and goalkicker.
Its not a matter of selecting him or not, but the above is a noticeable (and for me a sad) decline from "then" to "now".
@Windows97 said in All Blacks 2022:
Now he's no longer the starting first 5 and goalkicker.
Their hardly going to change the kicker just because he comes back. Kicking is typically about consistency, might as well use the guy who's able to achieve that.
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@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2022:
@booboo just saying the criteria make Japan look far worse than if RWC included. I am interested in the strength of the home factor
Ok. Almost makes some sense now.
@booboo said in All Blacks 2022:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2022:
@booboo just saying the criteria make Japan look far worse than if RWC included. I am interested in the strength of the home factor
Ok. Almost makes some sense now.
Almost? My point is simple, the cutoff seems arbitrary.
Why count games from the last RWC but not the last RWC?
And if we include the last RWC (as I think we should as it is the most important way to gauge the international teams, arguably) the story would be really different from the below and show Japan does not deserve to be 10 out of 10.
Edit even if 10th the game % would show they are not hopeless
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@Windows97 said in All Blacks 2022:
Now he's no longer the starting first 5 and goalkicker.
Their hardly going to change the kicker just because he comes back. Kicking is typically about consistency, might as well use the guy who's able to achieve that.
@Bones said in All Blacks 2022:
@Windows97 said in All Blacks 2022:
Now he's no longer the starting first 5 and goalkicker.
Their hardly going to change the kicker just because he comes back. Kicking is typically about consistency, might as well use the guy who's able to achieve that.
I'm not saying who should or shouldn't kick goals, or who should or shouldn't be in the team, all I'm trying to say is that his decline from being our first choice #10 and goal kicker to an almost bit player now is, in my mind - sad.
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@Bones said in All Blacks 2022:
@Windows97 said in All Blacks 2022:
Now he's no longer the starting first 5 and goalkicker.
Their hardly going to change the kicker just because he comes back. Kicking is typically about consistency, might as well use the guy who's able to achieve that.
I'm not saying who should or shouldn't kick goals, or who should or shouldn't be in the team, all I'm trying to say is that his decline from being our first choice #10 and goal kicker to an almost bit player now is, in my mind - sad.
@Windows97 BB's situation isn't as sad as the fate of players who get overtaken and drop out of the squad entirely. He is still there and can slot in at 10 and 15 when required, which is fortunate because of the lack of depth (particularly at 10).
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@Windows97 BB's situation isn't as sad as the fate of players who get overtaken and drop out of the squad entirely. He is still there and can slot in at 10 and 15 when required, which is fortunate because of the lack of depth (particularly at 10).
@Stargazer That is very true
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@Bones said in All Blacks 2022:
@Windows97 said in All Blacks 2022:
Now he's no longer the starting first 5 and goalkicker.
Their hardly going to change the kicker just because he comes back. Kicking is typically about consistency, might as well use the guy who's able to achieve that.
I'm not saying who should or shouldn't kick goals, or who should or shouldn't be in the team, all I'm trying to say is that his decline from being our first choice #10 and goal kicker to an almost bit player now is, in my mind - sad.
@Windows97 said in All Blacks 2022:
@Bones said in All Blacks 2022:
@Windows97 said in All Blacks 2022:
Now he's no longer the starting first 5 and goalkicker.
Their hardly going to change the kicker just because he comes back. Kicking is typically about consistency, might as well use the guy who's able to achieve that.
I'm not saying who should or shouldn't kick goals, or who should or shouldn't be in the team, all I'm trying to say is that his decline from being our first choice #10 and goal kicker to an almost bit player now is, in my mind - sad.
He's the starting 15. Not sure I should feel sad for an All Black in the top XV.
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Yeah, they're revisiting the duel playmaker tactic, and Beauden has played a lot more 15 so it makes sense to put him at the back. It failed at the last RWC as Mo'unga was too green, but in theory it can give us a lot of options on attack, especially with Jordie slotting in at 12 as well. I'm pretty excited about our backline at the moment.
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Yeah, they're revisiting the duel playmaker tactic, and Beauden has played a lot more 15 so it makes sense to put him at the back. It failed at the last RWC as Mo'unga was too green, but in theory it can give us a lot of options on attack, especially with Jordie slotting in at 12 as well. I'm pretty excited about our backline at the moment.
@No-Quarter said in All Blacks 2022:
Yeah, they're revisiting the duel playmaker tactic, and Beauden has played a lot more 15 so it makes sense to put him at the back. It failed at the last RWC as Mo'unga was too green, but in theory it can give us a lot of options on attack, especially with Jordie slotting in at 12 as well. I'm pretty excited about our backline at the moment.
It used to be a duel playmaker for sure, with Beaudy stepping in too much. Hopefully that's sorted and they'll share the role better as dual playmakers.
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@No-Quarter said in All Blacks 2022:
Yeah, they're revisiting the duel playmaker tactic, and Beauden has played a lot more 15 so it makes sense to put him at the back. It failed at the last RWC as Mo'unga was too green, but in theory it can give us a lot of options on attack, especially with Jordie slotting in at 12 as well. I'm pretty excited about our backline at the moment.
It used to be a duel playmaker for sure, with Beaudy stepping in too much. Hopefully that's sorted and they'll share the role better as dual playmakers.
@Machpants And it's not just the dual playmakers as much as kicking options, and thats where it works well with Havili or Jordie at 12, with BB or JB at 15, means you can actually play and kick from wider which stops defence being too settled. If you watch Crusaders Havili plays 2nd playmaker well, and like Jordie can first reciever and run ball up and allow RMo to have space, or if they set up ball get hopefully quick 2nd phase ball to play with.
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I think when Brodie comes back , scooter plays 6 , Akira is on the bench and frizzle misses out .
7 is the bigger headache , I think dalton is going to move ahead of cane in value further, particularly with ability to carry over the gainline as well as do the defensive stuff .
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I think when Brodie comes back , scooter plays 6 , Akira is on the bench and frizzle misses out .
7 is the bigger headache , I think dalton is going to move ahead of cane in value further, particularly with ability to carry over the gainline as well as do the defensive stuff .
@kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks vs Wales:
I think when Brodie comes back , scooter plays 6 , Akira is on the bench and frizzle misses out .
7 is the bigger headache , I think dalton is going to move ahead of cane in value further, particularly with ability to carry over the gainline as well as do the defensive stuff .
Shows what a bit of consistent game time in the right position can do for standout super rugby players in top teams might also be something to consider.
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I think when Brodie comes back , scooter plays 6 , Akira is on the bench and frizzle misses out .
7 is the bigger headache , I think dalton is going to move ahead of cane in value further, particularly with ability to carry over the gainline as well as do the defensive stuff .
@kiwiinmelb serious question, has Brodie outplayed Scott at lock?
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@kiwiinmelb serious question, has Brodie outplayed Scott at lock?
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2022:
@kiwiinmelb serious question, has Brodie outplayed Scott at lock?
Would you rather have Rettalick in the 23 or Frizzell..
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After watching the Welsh test again, SB could do everything that Frizell did as a 6. I would hope that our blindside flanker is more effective when carrying the ball.
@Bovidae Every other top test nation is playing a lock at 6, S.Barrett offers everything we need there and is necessary to complete an otherwise incomplete backrow carrying 2 opensides (Cane+Savea) which Foster is welded to.
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After watching the Welsh test again, SB could do everything that Frizell did as a 6. I would hope that our blindside flanker is more effective when carrying the ball.
@Bovidae said in All Blacks 2022:
After watching the Welsh test again, SB could do everything that Frizell did as a 6. I would hope that our blindside flanker is more effective when carrying the ball.
Everything and more. Starting SB at 6 would allow two loosies on the bench too - Akira and Harmon.
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@Bovidae Every other top test nation is playing a lock at 6, S.Barrett offers everything we need there and is necessary to complete an otherwise incomplete backrow carrying 2 opensides (Cane+Savea) which Foster is welded to.
@kiwi_expat Wow didn't know that.
And I used to think that Ireland France Wales Scotland and Argentina had gone the more the other way like NZ. And come to think of it doesn't South Africa use Kwagga and Aussie Samu and England Willis off the bench?
Actually Woki and Beirne are more like loosies playing at lock. How have their teams gone when adopting the opposing philosophy?
Really only England then?
Nevertheless I agree that Scott Barrett is a good option to balance out our smaller number eight. -
@Bones said in All Blacks 2022:
@kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks vs Wales:
I think when Brodie comes back , scooter plays 6 , Akira is on the bench and frizzle misses out .
7 is the bigger headache , I think dalton is going to move ahead of cane in value further, particularly with ability to carry over the gainline as well as do the defensive stuff .Shows what a bit of consistent game time in the right position can do for standout super rugby players in top teams might also be something to consider.
Ok it seems the consensus is yes.
My view is different, SB is better at lock than at 6. Whether that means he shouldn't move to 6 to fix somewhere else, I don't know. He's actually not that much bigger than Shannon or Akira.
