ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?

[W32]

This post is deleted!

[W32]

@canefan said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2024:

This comment from Razor kind of pisses me off

“They’ve got a got a great balance. They’ve got youth coming through, they’ve got great benches, they finish over top of teams and they’ve got big squads – they can have two really quality XVs"

And how do you know we don't Scott?

I just did the tedious process of going through our lineups this year, and the stark reality is, the selectors played the same guys all game every game.

Williams, Taylor, Lomax, Vaai, SBarrett, Savea, BBarrett, DMac JBarrett, and Ioane, all basically started every game this year, and played huge minutes. Cane, Jordan, Clarke and Patty T played every game they were available. Once Sititi took his chance, he played non stop. ALB locked in one bench spot, and started any time JB didn't. EdG was the other one if he didn't be a bit naughty.
Those guys played nearly the whole season in terms of the minutes available. No one else got a reasonable shot at anything.

Most unlike Rassie

Actually, I think the ABs and springboks used the same number of players this year

[W32]

@canefan said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@nostrildamus said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@African-Monkey said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@Bovidae said in All Blacks 2025:

Good to read that the five SR CEOs are unanimous in their push-back of Robertson wanting to select from overseas. Their reasons are exactly what has been discussed here.

As should be the case.

It also helps a lot when people like Stephen Donald come out and slam the idea in public.

That was such a rant, wasn't it!
He might have been motivated to defend his Chiefs pal DMac, but boy I enjoyed it.

JK too. I don't think Razor will find many allies in NZ and it still puzzles that after getting his dream job this is the hill he wants to die on. Just bloody coach man (and properly select)

Even Jake White says yeah nah

https://www.planetrugby.com/news/springboks-great-warns-all-blacks-will-go-backwards-at-a-rate-of-knots-if-scott-robertson-backed-plan-is-supported-by-nzr

Jake White is a washed up tool who thinks he’s some kind of oracle. Wouldn’t put much stock in what he thinks, might be hoping for NZ rugby further demise.

[W32]

@MN5 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

Beaver was getting quite hot under the collar there.

…….and good on him too, what a welcome change from the circle jerk Razor fluffers we’ve become so accustomed to.

I don’t like razor, but why not let him pick the players he wants? He was picked to be a winning coach and wants to pick players who play out of the country. This circle the wagons mentality from NZ rugby is shortsighted and is hurting your national team. Laughable that beaver thinks players have to sacrifice money play for the jersey. These are professional players!

[Bones]

@W32 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@MN5 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

Beaver was getting quite hot under the collar there.

…….and good on him too, what a welcome change from the circle jerk Razor fluffers we’ve become so accustomed to.

I don’t like razor, but why not let him pick the players he wants? He was picked to be a winning coach and wants to pick players who play out of the country. This circle the wagons mentality from NZ rugby is shortsighted and is hurting your national team. Laughable that beaver thinks players have to sacrifice money play for the jersey. These are professional players!

I'm prepared to back Jake White over this disconnected waffle.

[nzzp]

@W32 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@MN5 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

Beaver was getting quite hot under the collar there.

…….and good on him too, what a welcome change from the circle jerk Razor fluffers we’ve become so accustomed to.

I don’t like razor, but why not let him pick the players he wants? He was picked to be a winning coach and wants to pick players who play out of the country. This circle the wagons mentality from NZ rugby is shortsighted and is hurting your national team. Laughable that beaver thinks players have to sacrifice money play for the jersey. These are professional players!

Fundamentally disagree.

Right now SA are doing OK picking overseas players. There is no guarantee that this lasts though. England and France lost control of their players to clubs - and I think suffered as a result. When you lose control of the players, conditioning and style of play you also struggle to get them into camp, and to have them in the shape you want for the style you want. NZR had an advantage (like Wales) that they contracted players and therefore could manage workloads, etc.

You also have season issues in NZ. Playing up north means you get fresh players (rusty?) at the end of SH season, and tired players for the June internationals. Plus the travel.

Then you go to the comp. Take out the players, the quality drops further and the ability to generate revenue reduces. Works for SA as they mostly play in URC - because timezone works... so not having to fund or operate a competition like Super.

The upside is you get to pick the best players wherever they play.

Overall, I think it is short sighted and would ruin our domestic comps. The root cause though is that Super and NPC are shadows of what they were. When they were the best comps, you saw NZ SA AUS players shining in Tests, and players coming south looking like the pace was too much for them. That is not the case any more. After 2015 when SH dominated the semifinals, NH went away and got better. Our job is to respond and build what works for us, not to try and copy somethign we will be less at.

Losing SA from Super was massive and will have long term (bad) consequences for the SH unions I think.

thanks for coming to my Ted talk

[W32]

@Bones said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@W32 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@MN5 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

Beaver was getting quite hot under the collar there.

…….and good on him too, what a welcome change from the circle jerk Razor fluffers we’ve become so accustomed to.

I don’t like razor, but why not let him pick the players he wants? He was picked to be a winning coach and wants to pick players who play out of the country. This circle the wagons mentality from NZ rugby is shortsighted and is hurting your national team. Laughable that beaver thinks players have to sacrifice money play for the jersey. These are professional players!

I'm prepared to back Jake White over this disconnected waffle.

Sure, justify your viewpoint even if it means siding with a clown

[Bones]

@W32 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@Bones said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@W32 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@MN5 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

Beaver was getting quite hot under the collar there.

…….and good on him too, what a welcome change from the circle jerk Razor fluffers we’ve become so accustomed to.

I don’t like razor, but why not let him pick the players he wants? He was picked to be a winning coach and wants to pick players who play out of the country. This circle the wagons mentality from NZ rugby is shortsighted and is hurting your national team. Laughable that beaver thinks players have to sacrifice money play for the jersey. These are professional players!

I'm prepared to back Jake White over this disconnected waffle.

Sure, justify your viewpoint even if it means siding with a clown

It says something when White is more in touch with the vibe than you eh.

[ARHS]

@W32 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@canefan said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2024:

This comment from Razor kind of pisses me off

“They’ve got a got a great balance. They’ve got youth coming through, they’ve got great benches, they finish over top of teams and they’ve got big squads – they can have two really quality XVs"

And how do you know we don't Scott?

I just did the tedious process of going through our lineups this year, and the stark reality is, the selectors played the same guys all game every game.

Williams, Taylor, Lomax, Vaai, SBarrett, Savea, BBarrett, DMac JBarrett, and Ioane, all basically started every game this year, and played huge minutes. Cane, Jordan, Clarke and Patty T played every game they were available. Once Sititi took his chance, he played non stop. ALB locked in one bench spot, and started any time JB didn't. EdG was the other one if he didn't be a bit naughty.
Those guys played nearly the whole season in terms of the minutes available. No one else got a reasonable shot at anything.

Most unlike Rassie

Actually, I think the ABs and springboks used the same number of players this year

What? Sarcasm or poor research? Boks played 50 players this year. A lot of the fringers got multiple opportunities by plan. Razor stuck to core and seemingly only added opportunities via injuries. Compare Hanekom to Lio Willie and Jayden Hendrikse to Harry Plummer for involvement.

[W32]

@Bones said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@W32 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@Bones said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@W32 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@MN5 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

Beaver was getting quite hot under the collar there.

…….and good on him too, what a welcome change from the circle jerk Razor fluffers we’ve become so accustomed to.

I don’t like razor, but why not let him pick the players he wants? He was picked to be a winning coach and wants to pick players who play out of the country. This circle the wagons mentality from NZ rugby is shortsighted and is hurting your national team. Laughable that beaver thinks players have to sacrifice money play for the jersey. These are professional players!

I'm prepared to back Jake White over this disconnected waffle.

Sure, justify your viewpoint even if it means siding with a clown

It says something when White is more in touch with the vibe than you eh.

The vibe? Sorry, didn’t realize I was supposed to be vibing. With your provincial comps not doing well and rugby generally in decline in NZ picking players that will allow NZ to return to the top will incentivize youngsters to play and will pay off in the long term. It will also give more players exposure to rugby in places other than NZ and give them the chance to be noticed. Give razor what he wants and judge him on that.

[W32]

@ARHS said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@W32 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@canefan said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2024:

This comment from Razor kind of pisses me off

“They’ve got a got a great balance. They’ve got youth coming through, they’ve got great benches, they finish over top of teams and they’ve got big squads – they can have two really quality XVs"

And how do you know we don't Scott?

I just did the tedious process of going through our lineups this year, and the stark reality is, the selectors played the same guys all game every game.

Williams, Taylor, Lomax, Vaai, SBarrett, Savea, BBarrett, DMac JBarrett, and Ioane, all basically started every game this year, and played huge minutes. Cane, Jordan, Clarke and Patty T played every game they were available. Once Sititi took his chance, he played non stop. ALB locked in one bench spot, and started any time JB didn't. EdG was the other one if he didn't be a bit naughty.
Those guys played nearly the whole season in terms of the minutes available. No one else got a reasonable shot at anything.

Most unlike Rassie

Actually, I think the ABs and springboks used the same number of players this year

What? Sarcasm or poor research? Boks played 50 players this year. A lot of the fringers got multiple opportunities by plan. Razor stuck to core and seemingly only added opportunities via injuries. Compare Hanekom to Lio Willie and Jayden Hendrikse to Harry Plummer for involvement.

The very unforgiving NZ rugby public means razor had to produce from the word go. I can’t imagine what people on here would be saying if he had lost a few more this year through blooding new players. Rassie used 52 actually.

[Bones]

@W32 dead right, should have done it 30 years ago. We might have won a couple of world cups and dominated world rankings if we had.

[ARHS]

@W32 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

Give razor what he wants and judge him on that.

Are you an ex-Crusader angling for a bigger pay cheque and international exposure? That is the vibe you give.

[W32]

@Bones said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@W32 dead right, should have done it 30 years ago. We might have won a couple of world cups and dominated world rankings if we had.

The NZ way isn’t working according to many NZ players and coaches. What worked for 30 years may not work now. You sound like a lot of afrikaaners did after re inclusion. Many changes had to happen in order for the springboks to evolve.

[W32]

@ARHS said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@W32 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

Give razor what he wants and judge him on that.

Are you an ex-Crusader angling for a bigger pay cheque and international exposure? That is the vibe you give.

It’s about winning

[nzzp]

@W32 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@ARHS said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@W32 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

Give razor what he wants and judge him on that.

Are you an ex-Crusader angling for a bigger pay cheque and international exposure? That is the vibe you give.

It’s about winning

Beaudy at 10? That's 'winning'?

Tight 5 aside, the team has been very disappointing

[W32]

@nzzp said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@W32 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@ARHS said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@W32 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

Give razor what he wants and judge him on that.

Are you an ex-Crusader angling for a bigger pay cheque and international exposure? That is the vibe you give.

It’s about winning

Beaudy at 10? That's 'winning'?

Tight 5 aside, the team has been very disappointing

That’s my point. Picking any player he wants will result in more winning. Mo’unga would be a better choice.

[taniwharugby]

@W32 and sustainability, that IMO goes out the window if this change is made, given we are already teetering on the edge.

[W32]

@taniwharugby said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@W32 and sustainability, that IMO goes out the window if this change is made, given we are already teetering on the edge.

I’m not sure about that. Rugby players will always want to play for the AB’s. Rugby won’t just go away, the culture is too strong.

[nzzp]

@W32 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@nzzp said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@W32 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@ARHS said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

@W32 said in ABs picking overseas players - inevitable?:

Give razor what he wants and judge him on that.

Are you an ex-Crusader angling for a bigger pay cheque and international exposure? That is the vibe you give.

It’s about winning

Beaudy at 10? That's 'winning'?

Tight 5 aside, the team has been very disappointing

That’s my point. Picking any player he wants will result in more winning. Mo’unga would be a better choice.

Not picking the best 10 in the squad, let alone eligible is the issue