RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks
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Let's be honest the first 30 was shite
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@antipodean said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
How the fuck people are blaming players for losing by a point after playing the majority of the game a man down beggars belief. The slightest bit of competence from the officials and we won that.
Both things can be true in this case mate. Sometimes the ref doesn't see it your way. But self inflicted wounds are coach killers
@canefan said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@antipodean said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
How the fuck people are blaming players for losing by a point after playing the majority of the game a man down beggars belief. The slightest bit of competence from the officials and we won that.
Both things can be true in this case mate. Sometimes the ref doesn't see it your way. But self inflicted wounds are coach killers
Nah, that denies our players the kudos for being in the game right up until the final minute. That was a heroic effort and we were utterly fucked by disgraceful refereeing.
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One bit of good news, no, two:
We have the players.
Our forwards are now good enough.
We just need the plays (strategies) and the clinical execution. Oh and stop the 50-50s Jordie, when you do the basics so well you don't need them. -
@mariner4life said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@nostrildamus said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@mariner4life said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
That final play sort of summed it up
DMac somehow breaks the field open. Savea (who was exhausted) wasn't clean, and nor was ALB.I may be alone on this but I would have played DMac a lot earlier.
No, it was clear that the game was crying out for his skill set
I worry about his size but he seems to have this erratic style the Boks don't cope with well (on a good day).
@nostrildamus said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@mariner4life said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@nostrildamus said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@mariner4life said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
That final play sort of summed it up
DMac somehow breaks the field open. Savea (who was exhausted) wasn't clean, and nor was ALB.I may be alone on this but I would have played DMac a lot earlier.
No, it was clear that the game was crying out for his skill set
I worry about his size but he seems to have this erratic style the Boks don't cope with well (on a good day).
Looked in control too though. I look forward to seeing him at 10 next season
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One bit of good news, no, two:
We have the players.
Our forwards are now good enough.
We just need the plays (strategies) and the clinical execution. Oh and stop the 50-50s Jordie, when you do the basics so well you don't need them.@nostrildamus said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
One bit of good news, no, two:
We have the players.
Our forwards are now good enough.
We just need the plays (strategies) and the clinical execution. Oh and stop the 50-50s Jordie, when you do the basics so well you don't need them.I love him to bits, but I think he should have carted it up more
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@mariner4life said in [RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks]
Frizzell was carded for falling over
That's the one we were really dudded on, I think.
"A rugby collision", O'Keefe said - and that's basically what this was. They said as much when they didn't upgrade it. And handed the Boks the early momentum.
@Chris-B said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@mariner4life said in [RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks]
Frizzell was carded for falling over
That's the one we were really dudded on, I think.
"A rugby collision", O'Keefe said - and that's basically what this was. They said as much when they didn't upgrade it. And handed the Boks the early momentum.
I didn’t know the law / focus area of not allowing people to fall on exposed knees etc - ITV had the Irish ref on call who immediately called it as an issue, Barnes then reffed it exactly as he said he should. He was actually concerned it would be red. The fact we didn’t know about it doesn’t mean it wasn’t reffed correctly
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@nostrildamus said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@mariner4life said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@nostrildamus said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@mariner4life said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
That final play sort of summed it up
DMac somehow breaks the field open. Savea (who was exhausted) wasn't clean, and nor was ALB.I may be alone on this but I would have played DMac a lot earlier.
No, it was clear that the game was crying out for his skill set
I worry about his size but he seems to have this erratic style the Boks don't cope with well (on a good day).
Looked in control too though. I look forward to seeing him at 10 next season
@canefan said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@nostrildamus said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@mariner4life said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@nostrildamus said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@mariner4life said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
That final play sort of summed it up
DMac somehow breaks the field open. Savea (who was exhausted) wasn't clean, and nor was ALB.I may be alone on this but I would have played DMac a lot earlier.
No, it was clear that the game was crying out for his skill set
I worry about his size but he seems to have this erratic style the Boks don't cope with well (on a good day).
Looked in control too though. I look forward to seeing him at 10 next season
I totally agree. Didn't like him at all at 10, he totally changed my mind in the last year. I also look forward to the next 15 whoever it is. And I'd like to see Narawa join Telea in the wings. But in the forwards I don't know who they will pick - as a pack-apart from the front row (and who will be hooker after Sami T?) they could look very raw.
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Well done Springboks, the more clinical team won.
Some of my thoughts on the game:
- All Blacks had plenty of opportunity to win that game, but were not good enough.
A couple of dud line outs early on, knock ons, forcing unnecessary 50/50 passes.
- The highly controversial calls all went against us.
The penalty which Barnes then said sorry, that wasn’t actually a penalty. That 3 points made a difference. The TMO gets involved and changes calls all the time, so why can’t a ref change his call in this instance, when he’s clearly fucked up.
The inconsistency in dishing out cards. How the fuck Cane got red and Kolisi didn’t is an absolute disgrace and a blight on the game.
- Boks slowing tactics. Again.
Something seriously needs to be done to put an end to these endless stoppages.
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The ABs ability to still be in with a chance to win after playing the majority of the game with only 14 men. I thought it was absolutely game over when the red card came. So that was bloody gutsy and admirable.
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The most obvious and costly thing for me, The ABs lack of composure when it mattered. Many times we got into the Bok red zone, and we forced a pass that didn’t need to be forced or dropped the ball, or fluffed a lineout.
Fuck fuck fuck!
@Gunner said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
he penalty which Barnes then said sorry, that wasn’t actually a penalty. That 3 points made a difference. The TMO gets involved and changes calls all the time, so why can’t a ref change his call in this instance, when he’s clearly fucked up.
Yeah this is the only reffing thing that really annoys me
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Edit: BB played better than I expected in this RWC but I'd still like to see new options and I assume he is off overseas.
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@NTA said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@MN5 said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@NTA said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
I have no problem with the outcome of either captain's card. Clear difference based on the framework and mitigation.
Can you elaborate further ? How was Canes harsher than Kolisis ? ( i missed part of the latters as I was getting my third helping of bacon and eggs )
Cane was upright, with reasonable force, direct contact. No mitigation.
Kolisi had contact through the body, lowered himself a little, and the head contact was almost incidental like a whiplash.
Fair enough. They looked about as harsh as eachothers to my ( untrained ) eye.
Nisbo thought so too.
@MN5 said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
Nisbo thought so too
Yeah. Nisbo also thinks anyone with dark skin in a green jersey is Mapimpi, so...
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@Chris-B said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@mariner4life said in [RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks]
Frizzell was carded for falling over
That's the one we were really dudded on, I think.
"A rugby collision", O'Keefe said - and that's basically what this was. They said as much when they didn't upgrade it. And handed the Boks the early momentum.
I didn’t know the law / focus area of not allowing people to fall on exposed knees etc - ITV had the Irish ref on call who immediately called it as an issue, Barnes then reffed it exactly as he said he should. He was actually concerned it would be red. The fact we didn’t know about it doesn’t mean it wasn’t reffed correctly
@Dodge said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@Chris-B said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@mariner4life said in [RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks]
Frizzell was carded for falling over
That's the one we were really dudded on, I think.
"A rugby collision", O'Keefe said - and that's basically what this was. They said as much when they didn't upgrade it. And handed the Boks the early momentum.
I didn’t know the law / focus area of not allowing people to fall on exposed knees etc - ITV had the Irish ref on call who immediately called it as an issue, Barnes then reffed it exactly as he said he should. He was actually concerned it would be red. The fact we didn’t know about it doesn’t mean it wasn’t reffed correctly
Which law?
If he'd done it intentionally, it would have been red. Accidentally falling on someone is an accident.
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@mariner4life said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
That final play sort of summed it up
DMac somehow breaks the field open. Savea (who was exhausted) wasn't clean, and nor was ALB.I may be alone on this but I would have played DMac a lot earlier.
@nostrildamus I would have swapped him for BB at the end. Richie was playing well and when he was running alongside Telea they were creating chances. Great footwork from both of them.
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I think losing by 20 after the red card would have been easier to take. But SAfrica (except for PSDT) played a stinker after the first 30. Should have, could have, would have. I hate being so invested in a fucking GAME of sports, it's not like my life is in any way changed because of this outcome...
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@Dodge said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@Chris-B said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@mariner4life said in [RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks]
Frizzell was carded for falling over
That's the one we were really dudded on, I think.
"A rugby collision", O'Keefe said - and that's basically what this was. They said as much when they didn't upgrade it. And handed the Boks the early momentum.
I didn’t know the law / focus area of not allowing people to fall on exposed knees etc - ITV had the Irish ref on call who immediately called it as an issue, Barnes then reffed it exactly as he said he should. He was actually concerned it would be red. The fact we didn’t know about it doesn’t mean it wasn’t reffed correctly
Which law?
If he'd done it intentionally, it would have been red. Accidentally falling on someone is an accident.
@Chris-B said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@Dodge said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@Chris-B said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@mariner4life said in [RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks]
Frizzell was carded for falling over
That's the one we were really dudded on, I think.
"A rugby collision", O'Keefe said - and that's basically what this was. They said as much when they didn't upgrade it. And handed the Boks the early momentum.
I didn’t know the law / focus area of not allowing people to fall on exposed knees etc - ITV had the Irish ref on call who immediately called it as an issue, Barnes then reffed it exactly as he said he should. He was actually concerned it would be red. The fact we didn’t know about it doesn’t mean it wasn’t reffed correctly
Which law?
If he'd done it intentionally, it would have been red. Accidentally falling on someone is an accident.
It didn’t look 100% accidental to me, at very best it was very careless, I think they gave him the benefit of the doubt on review - ie found mitigation
Edit Also, accidentally hitting someone in the head isn’t ok, it can be, but isn’t always.
Anyway, I don’t know the law or how it’s been told to be reffed well enough so am only going on what the ref in the studio said
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@MN5 said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
Nisbo thought so too
Yeah. Nisbo also thinks anyone with dark skin in a green jersey is Mapimpi, so...
@NTA said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@MN5 said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
Nisbo thought so too
Yeah. Nisbo also thinks anyone with dark skin in a green jersey is Mapimpi, so...
It was confusing for the poor guy when he marked Telea it has to be said
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@nostrildamus I would have swapped him for BB at the end. Richie was playing well and when he was running alongside Telea they were creating chances. Great footwork from both of them.
@Paekakboyz said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@nostrildamus I would have swapped him for BB at the end. Richie was playing well and when he was running alongside Telea they were creating chances. Great footwork from both of them.
yes Richie played well and was brave.
I think the entire ABs should be thanked actually, 2 cards down, not their day, they came close and gave it their all.
So I came back to my earlier concerns about BB, cards, and Taylor (who was good enough for the call up but I'm not sure he's our #1 hooker) but really, they played as well as expected.
And as we all said, our kicking lets us down. -
@Dodge said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@Chris-B said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@mariner4life said in [RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks]
Frizzell was carded for falling over
That's the one we were really dudded on, I think.
"A rugby collision", O'Keefe said - and that's basically what this was. They said as much when they didn't upgrade it. And handed the Boks the early momentum.
I didn’t know the law / focus area of not allowing people to fall on exposed knees etc - ITV had the Irish ref on call who immediately called it as an issue, Barnes then reffed it exactly as he said he should. He was actually concerned it would be red. The fact we didn’t know about it doesn’t mean it wasn’t reffed correctly
Which law?
If he'd done it intentionally, it would have been red. Accidentally falling on someone is an accident.
@Chris-B said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@Dodge said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@Chris-B said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@mariner4life said in [RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks]
Frizzell was carded for falling over
That's the one we were really dudded on, I think.
"A rugby collision", O'Keefe said - and that's basically what this was. They said as much when they didn't upgrade it. And handed the Boks the early momentum.
I didn’t know the law / focus area of not allowing people to fall on exposed knees etc - ITV had the Irish ref on call who immediately called it as an issue, Barnes then reffed it exactly as he said he should. He was actually concerned it would be red. The fact we didn’t know about it doesn’t mean it wasn’t reffed correctly
Which law?
If he'd done it intentionally, it would have been red. Accidentally falling on someone is an accident.
20d, and intentionally is not mentioned in that law
Dangerous play in a ruck or maul.
A player must not charge into a ruck or maul. Charging includes any contact made without binding onto another player in the ruck or maul.
A player must not make contact with an opponent above the line of the shoulders.
A player must not intentionally collapse a ruck or a maul.
A player may lever the jackler out of the contest at the ruck but must not drop their weight onto them or target the lower limbs. -
@mariner4life said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
That final play sort of summed it up
DMac somehow breaks the field open. Savea (who was exhausted) wasn't clean, and nor was ALB.I may be alone on this but I would have played DMac a lot earlier.
@nostrildamus said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
@mariner4life said in RWC Final: All Blacks v Springboks:
That final play sort of summed it up
DMac somehow breaks the field open. Savea (who was exhausted) wasn't clean, and nor was ALB.I may be alone on this but I would have played DMac a lot earlier.
And I would have taken BB off not Mo.
