All Blacks 2025
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@booboo said in Moana Pasifika v Blues:
@reprobate said in Moana Pasifika v Blues:
7 has always been his best position
12?
If he moved to 12 now, it would mean Jules being dropped - which would be a pretty sweet move on Ardie's part.
@reprobate ultimate flex
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@ploughboy Wallace Sititi can obviously cover 6 so can Scott Barrett. Two specialist 6s may be seen as a luxury. It really depends on other squad options.
@sparky said in All Blacks 2025:
@ploughboy Wallace Sititi can obviously cover 6 so can Scott Barrett. Two specialist 6s may be seen as a luxury. It really depends on other squad options.
Scott Barrett has always been pretty shit at 6, and he's certainly not got younger and faster. Other than in-game 3 x loose forward injuries absolute emergency, I'd hate to see him viewed as cover.
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@sparky said in All Blacks 2025:
@ploughboy Wallace Sititi can obviously cover 6 so can Scott Barrett. Two specialist 6s may be seen as a luxury. It really depends on other squad options.
Scott Barrett has always been pretty shit at 6, and he's certainly not got younger and faster. Other than in-game 3 x loose forward injuries absolute emergency, I'd hate to see him viewed as cover.
@reprobate yep, right now I think leaving him to focus on getting back to form at lock is more important.
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@sparky said in All Blacks 2025:
@ploughboy Wallace Sititi can obviously cover 6 so can Scott Barrett. Two specialist 6s may be seen as a luxury. It really depends on other squad options.
Scott Barrett has always been pretty shit at 6, and he's certainly not got younger and faster. Other than in-game 3 x loose forward injuries absolute emergency, I'd hate to see him viewed as cover.
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:
@sparky said in All Blacks 2025:
@ploughboy Wallace Sititi can obviously cover 6 so can Scott Barrett. Two specialist 6s may be seen as a luxury. It really depends on other squad options.
Scott Barrett has always been pretty shit at 6, and he's certainly not got younger and faster. Other than in-game 3 x loose forward injuries absolute emergency, I'd hate to see him viewed as cover.
Yeah but guys who can apparently ‘cover’ other positions is part of the whole coaching mantra. Not sure Razor will change that mentality.
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@reprobate yep, right now I think leaving him to focus on getting back to form at lock is more important.
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks 2025:
@reprobate yep, right now I think leaving him to focus on getting back to form at lock is more important.
Yeah, given he's captain we really need him to be a guaranteed starter. If they want a lock/6 then I think Ah Kuoi is the only viable option right now.
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I wonder if that means no Hoskins
@Crazy-Horse said in All Blacks 2025:
I wonder if that means no Hoskins
Even if fatty Ryan wasn't a hater, the problem for Hos is that he's an 8, in a team where the coach doesn't like specialists.
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It is Mark Robinson's former club too. I think it is good that they do this. When Foster was coach one of the AB squad announcements was from TA Sports.
@Bovidae said in All Blacks 2025:
It is Mark Robinson's former club too. I think it is good that they do this. When Foster was coach one of the AB squad announcements was from TA Sports.
I also pleased to see Coastal used for announcement! There is a club that deserves credit, last year they actually brought a farm , use the profit to help keep costs down for players, and they look after the gear etc of the Opunake College teams,as well as Saturday morning club.. They built up a dairy herd with help of club members, and leased a farm , put on a manager etc,until got into position to actually buy a farm. Never underestimate haw good the farming community is to be involved with!
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@Crazy-Horse said in All Blacks 2025:
I wonder if that means no Hoskins
Even if fatty Ryan wasn't a hater, the problem for Hos is that he's an 8, in a team where the coach doesn't like specialists.
@antipodean said in All Blacks 2025:
@Crazy-Horse said in All Blacks 2025:
I wonder if that means no Hoskins
Even if fatty Ryan wasn't a hater, the problem for Hos is that he's an 8, in a team where the coach doesn't like specialists.
I know I'm a broken record on the subject, but I'm going to be extremely fucked off (again) when they don't pick him.
Think it was Mariner who used the phrase "guys who move the needle". That is exactly who I think Sotutu is. He will never have the number of involvements someone like Blackadder/Papalii/Jacobson does, but he may well be the guy who creates the winning try against a tight defence.
I am still holding out some slim hopes based on Ardie now looking like a definite starter at 7 rather than 8, someone's bit of gossip earlier in the season about Ryan and Sotutu having had a positive chat, and that he has built into the season slowly - he was the one Blues guy who I think really lifted to try and get them back up over Moana. When Roberston picks (the admittedly excellent) Lio-Willie instead, it's going to do my head in. We can't afford our coaches to ignore guys like Sotutu, they need to back themselves to get the best out of them.
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@antipodean said in All Blacks 2025:
@Crazy-Horse said in All Blacks 2025:
I wonder if that means no Hoskins
Even if fatty Ryan wasn't a hater, the problem for Hos is that he's an 8, in a team where the coach doesn't like specialists.
I know I'm a broken record on the subject, but I'm going to be extremely fucked off (again) when they don't pick him.
Think it was Mariner who used the phrase "guys who move the needle". That is exactly who I think Sotutu is. He will never have the number of involvements someone like Blackadder/Papalii/Jacobson does, but he may well be the guy who creates the winning try against a tight defence.
I am still holding out some slim hopes based on Ardie now looking like a definite starter at 7 rather than 8, someone's bit of gossip earlier in the season about Ryan and Sotutu having had a positive chat, and that he has built into the season slowly - he was the one Blues guy who I think really lifted to try and get them back up over Moana. When Roberston picks (the admittedly excellent) Lio-Willie instead, it's going to do my head in. We can't afford our coaches to ignore guys like Sotutu, they need to back themselves to get the best out of them.
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:
Ryan and Sotutu having had a positive chat
I can see Sotutu going overseas for the big $$$ and to play for England.
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@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:
Ryan and Sotutu having had a positive chat
I can see Sotutu going overseas for the big $$$ and to play for England.
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2025:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:
Ryan and Sotutu having had a positive chat
I can see Sotutu going overseas for the big $$$ and to play for England.
I not sure he would get in English squad. I have to admit, I not as convinced as some how good he is. Just personal thing.
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@Crazy-Horse said in All Blacks 2025:
I wonder if that means no Hoskins
Even if fatty Ryan wasn't a hater, the problem for Hos is that he's an 8, in a team where the coach doesn't like specialists.
@antipodean said in All Blacks 2025:
@Crazy-Horse said in All Blacks 2025:
I wonder if that means no Hoskins
Even if fatty Ryan wasn't a hater, the problem for Hos is that he's an 8, in a team where the coach doesn't like specialists.
And the third best 8 in NZ after Savea and Sititi.
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@antipodean said in All Blacks 2025:
@Crazy-Horse said in All Blacks 2025:
I wonder if that means no Hoskins
Even if fatty Ryan wasn't a hater, the problem for Hos is that he's an 8, in a team where the coach doesn't like specialists.
And the third best 8 in NZ after Savea and Sititi.
@Frank said in All Blacks 2025:
@antipodean said in All Blacks 2025:
@Crazy-Horse said in All Blacks 2025:
I wonder if that means no Hoskins
Even if fatty Ryan wasn't a hater, the problem for Hos is that he's an 8, in a team where the coach doesn't like specialists.
And the third best 8 in NZ after Savea and Sititi.
Who are the player of the year in 7, and the incumbent AB 6....
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@nzzp said in All Blacks 2025:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:
Ryan and Sotutu having had a positive chat
I can see Sotutu going overseas for the big $$$ and to play for England.
I not sure he would get in English squad. I have to admit, I not as convinced as some how good he is. Just personal thing.
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2025:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2025:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:
Ryan and Sotutu having had a positive chat
I can see Sotutu going overseas for the big $$$ and to play for England.
I not sure he would get in English squad. I have to admit, I not as convinced as some how good he is. Just personal thing.
Razor has hacked Dan's account
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@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2025:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2025:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:
Ryan and Sotutu having had a positive chat
I can see Sotutu going overseas for the big $$$ and to play for England.
I not sure he would get in English squad. I have to admit, I not as convinced as some how good he is. Just personal thing.
Razor has hacked Dan's account
@canefan said in All Blacks 2025:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2025:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2025:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:
Ryan and Sotutu having had a positive chat
I can see Sotutu going overseas for the big $$$ and to play for England.
I not sure he would get in English squad. I have to admit, I not as convinced as some how good he is. Just personal thing.
RazorTubby Ryan has hacked Dan's accountThis is how I would do it, and emphasis on the "personal thing".
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@nzzp said in All Blacks 2025:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:
Ryan and Sotutu having had a positive chat
I can see Sotutu going overseas for the big $$$ and to play for England.
I not sure he would get in English squad. I have to admit, I not as convinced as some how good he is. Just personal thing.
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2025:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2025:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:
Ryan and Sotutu having had a positive chat
I can see Sotutu going overseas for the big $$$ and to play for England.
I not sure he would get in English squad. I have to admit, I not as convinced as some how good he is. Just personal thing.
As it happens, they've just announced one:
Richard Capstick
Ben Curry
Alex Dombrandt
Emeka Illione
Jack Kenningham
Tom WillisIf he was eligible for that list, I'd reckon he'd be on it.
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@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2025:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2025:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:
Ryan and Sotutu having had a positive chat
I can see Sotutu going overseas for the big $$$ and to play for England.
I not sure he would get in English squad. I have to admit, I not as convinced as some how good he is. Just personal thing.
As it happens, they've just announced one:
Richard Capstick
Ben Curry
Alex Dombrandt
Emeka Illione
Jack Kenningham
Tom WillisIf he was eligible for that list, I'd reckon he'd be on it.
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2025:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2025:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:
Ryan and Sotutu having had a positive chat
I can see Sotutu going overseas for the big $$$ and to play for England.
I not sure he would get in English squad. I have to admit, I not as convinced as some how good he is. Just personal thing.
As it happens, they've just announced one:
Richard Capstick
Ben Curry
Alex Dombrandt
Emeka Illione
Jack Kenningham
Tom WillisIf he was eligible for that list, I'd reckon he'd be on it.
Three of them are with the Lions though
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@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2025:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2025:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:
Ryan and Sotutu having had a positive chat
I can see Sotutu going overseas for the big $$$ and to play for England.
I not sure he would get in English squad. I have to admit, I not as convinced as some how good he is. Just personal thing.
As it happens, they've just announced one:
Richard Capstick
Ben Curry
Alex Dombrandt
Emeka Illione
Jack Kenningham
Tom WillisIf he was eligible for that list, I'd reckon he'd be on it.
Three of them are with the Lions though
@MN5 said in All Blacks 2025:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2025:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2025:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:
Ryan and Sotutu having had a positive chat
I can see Sotutu going overseas for the big $$$ and to play for England.
I not sure he would get in English squad. I have to admit, I not as convinced as some how good he is. Just personal thing.
As it happens, they've just announced one:
Richard Capstick
Ben Curry
Alex Dombrandt
Emeka Illione
Jack Kenningham
Tom WillisIf he was eligible for that list, I'd reckon he'd be on it.
Three of them are with the Lions though
None of them are with the Lions, three others are (and there are injuries) - nevertheless, it's the current England squad.
edit: unless that's what Dan meant - he wouldn't make the squad because he'd be with the Lions? -
@MN5 said in All Blacks 2025:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2025:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2025:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:
Ryan and Sotutu having had a positive chat
I can see Sotutu going overseas for the big $$$ and to play for England.
I not sure he would get in English squad. I have to admit, I not as convinced as some how good he is. Just personal thing.
As it happens, they've just announced one:
Richard Capstick
Ben Curry
Alex Dombrandt
Emeka Illione
Jack Kenningham
Tom WillisIf he was eligible for that list, I'd reckon he'd be on it.
Three of them are with the Lions though
None of them are with the Lions, three others are (and there are injuries) - nevertheless, it's the current England squad.
edit: unless that's what Dan meant - he wouldn't make the squad because he'd be with the Lions?@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:
@MN5 said in All Blacks 2025:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2025:
@nzzp said in All Blacks 2025:
@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:
Ryan and Sotutu having had a positive chat
I can see Sotutu going overseas for the big $$$ and to play for England.
I not sure he would get in English squad. I have to admit, I not as convinced as some how good he is. Just personal thing.
As it happens, they've just announced one:
Richard Capstick
Ben Curry
Alex Dombrandt
Emeka Illione
Jack Kenningham
Tom WillisIf he was eligible for that list, I'd reckon he'd be on it.
Three of them are with the Lions though
None of them are with the Lions, three others are (and there are injuries) - nevertheless, it's the current England squad.
That's what I meant so it is a weakened squad
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My thoughts, a month out from squad selection...
Hookers
Guaranteed - Codie Taylor, Asafo Aumua, Samisoni Taukei'aho
George Bell drops out to accommodate the return of Taukei'aho. Brodie McAlister has also been playing well but there's just no space. A position of real strength at the moment.Props
Guaranteed - Tamaiti Williams, Tyrel Lomax, Fletcher Newell
Probable - Ethan de Groot, Pasilio Tosi, Ofa Tu'ungafasi (if fit)
Possible - George Bower, Ollie Norris, George Dyer
Razor could easily stick with the same six as last year, who all earned considerable minutes. There's a question mark hanging over Tu'ungafasi's availability which could open the door for another loosehead, while Dyer has once again been strong and started both games for the All Blacks XV at the end of last year.Locks
Guaranteed - Scott Barrett, Tupou Vaa'i
Probable - Patrick Tuipulotu
Possible - Josh Lord, Fabian Holland, Naitoa Ah Kuoi
Likely just a straight shoot-out between Lord and Holland unless there's room for five locks (which could be feasible, if Vaa'i is considered as a blindside option), although Sam Darry could make a miraculous return. Ah Kuoi is the dark horse, and featured for the All Blacks XV. Isaia Walker-Leawere started both matches for the XV but can't see him getting selected ahead of any of the other options.Loose forwards
Guaranteed - Wallace Sititi, Ardie Savea
Probable - Luke Jacobson, Ethan Blackadder, Peter Lakai, Samipeni Finau
Possible - Dalton Papali'i, Hoskins Sotutu, Simon Parker, Du'Plessis Kirifi
Papali'i was on the outer last year and hasn't done anything different this year for the Blues so it's difficult to see why Razor would change his approach here. With Savea, Lakai, Jacobson and Blackadder all capable of playing 7, there's not much need for either Papali'i or Kirifi. There might be room for a big bopper like Parker.Halfbacks
Guaranteed - Cam Roigard, Cortez Ratima
Probable - Noah Hotham
Possible - Folau Fakatava
Hotham has the inside running as the third halfback but Fakatava has made a few strides forward in recent times. The big question might be whether Hotham's availability for the Maori All Blacks will affect Razor's thinking - would it be better for him to start two games against Japan instead of holding tackle bags for the ABs, and Fakatava watching on TV?First fives
Guaranteed - Damian McKenzie, Beauden Barrett
There are no other realistic options at 10 right now. Jacomb simply isn't ready yet. Ruben Love and Stephen Perofeta could cover the role if selected but would likely primarily feature at fullback.Midfield
Guaranteed - Jordie Barrett, Rieko Ioane, Billy Proctor
Probable - Anton Lienert-Brown (if fit), Quinn Tupaea
Possible - David Havili, Xavi Taele, AJ Lam
With Jordie Barrett shouldering a heavy load over the past 18 months, Razor could opt for three 12 options - which may or may not include Lienert-Brown. Tupaea and Lam are probably going head-to-head for one spot, with both capable at 12 and an option on the wing. Ioane has been very average but won't drop straight out of the squad. Taele is my bolter.Outside backs
Guaranteed - Caleb Clarke, Will Jordan, Ruben Love
Probable - Sevu Reece
Possible - Mark Tele'a, Emoni Narawa, Caleb Tangitau (if fit), Stephen Perofeta, Chay Fihaki
Jordan and Love will cover fullback, with Beauden Barrett and McKenzie also options there, so there might not be room for Perofeta, who's been underwhelming. Reece is a Razor favourite, even if he does seem too slow in open space. Tele'a will probably miss out given he's heading overseas but we know that didn't stop Razor selecting Sam Cane and (in particular) TJ Perenara last year. Narawa has been consistently good for the Chiefs while Fihaki seems to have the inside running based on last year's 'selection' (and he's definitely been playing better this year, even if he's not bashing the door down still). -
My thoughts, a month out from squad selection...
Hookers
Guaranteed - Codie Taylor, Asafo Aumua, Samisoni Taukei'aho
George Bell drops out to accommodate the return of Taukei'aho. Brodie McAlister has also been playing well but there's just no space. A position of real strength at the moment.Props
Guaranteed - Tamaiti Williams, Tyrel Lomax, Fletcher Newell
Probable - Ethan de Groot, Pasilio Tosi, Ofa Tu'ungafasi (if fit)
Possible - George Bower, Ollie Norris, George Dyer
Razor could easily stick with the same six as last year, who all earned considerable minutes. There's a question mark hanging over Tu'ungafasi's availability which could open the door for another loosehead, while Dyer has once again been strong and started both games for the All Blacks XV at the end of last year.Locks
Guaranteed - Scott Barrett, Tupou Vaa'i
Probable - Patrick Tuipulotu
Possible - Josh Lord, Fabian Holland, Naitoa Ah Kuoi
Likely just a straight shoot-out between Lord and Holland unless there's room for five locks (which could be feasible, if Vaa'i is considered as a blindside option), although Sam Darry could make a miraculous return. Ah Kuoi is the dark horse, and featured for the All Blacks XV. Isaia Walker-Leawere started both matches for the XV but can't see him getting selected ahead of any of the other options.Loose forwards
Guaranteed - Wallace Sititi, Ardie Savea
Probable - Luke Jacobson, Ethan Blackadder, Peter Lakai, Samipeni Finau
Possible - Dalton Papali'i, Hoskins Sotutu, Simon Parker, Du'Plessis Kirifi
Papali'i was on the outer last year and hasn't done anything different this year for the Blues so it's difficult to see why Razor would change his approach here. With Savea, Lakai, Jacobson and Blackadder all capable of playing 7, there's not much need for either Papali'i or Kirifi. There might be room for a big bopper like Parker.Halfbacks
Guaranteed - Cam Roigard, Cortez Ratima
Probable - Noah Hotham
Possible - Folau Fakatava
Hotham has the inside running as the third halfback but Fakatava has made a few strides forward in recent times. The big question might be whether Hotham's availability for the Maori All Blacks will affect Razor's thinking - would it be better for him to start two games against Japan instead of holding tackle bags for the ABs, and Fakatava watching on TV?First fives
Guaranteed - Damian McKenzie, Beauden Barrett
There are no other realistic options at 10 right now. Jacomb simply isn't ready yet. Ruben Love and Stephen Perofeta could cover the role if selected but would likely primarily feature at fullback.Midfield
Guaranteed - Jordie Barrett, Rieko Ioane, Billy Proctor
Probable - Anton Lienert-Brown (if fit), Quinn Tupaea
Possible - David Havili, Xavi Taele, AJ Lam
With Jordie Barrett shouldering a heavy load over the past 18 months, Razor could opt for three 12 options - which may or may not include Lienert-Brown. Tupaea and Lam are probably going head-to-head for one spot, with both capable at 12 and an option on the wing. Ioane has been very average but won't drop straight out of the squad. Taele is my bolter.Outside backs
Guaranteed - Caleb Clarke, Will Jordan, Ruben Love
Probable - Sevu Reece
Possible - Mark Tele'a, Emoni Narawa, Caleb Tangitau (if fit), Stephen Perofeta, Chay Fihaki
Jordan and Love will cover fullback, with Beauden Barrett and McKenzie also options there, so there might not be room for Perofeta, who's been underwhelming. Reece is a Razor favourite, even if he does seem too slow in open space. Tele'a will probably miss out given he's heading overseas but we know that didn't stop Razor selecting Sam Cane and (in particular) TJ Perenara last year. Narawa has been consistently good for the Chiefs while Fihaki seems to have the inside running based on last year's 'selection' (and he's definitely been playing better this year, even if he's not bashing the door down still).@Mr-Fish Really summary of where we are at.
Maybe Reiko Ioane and Caleb Clarke are both Probables given how poor their Super Rugby has been so far this season.
Some really good players are going to miss out in the backrow.
We seem a little light in the midfield and short of real quality on the Wing. Not worried about anywhere else.
