All Blacks v Argentina I
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@ShaquilleOatmeal said in All Blacks v Argentina I:
McKenzie was given a good run of starts and, while things weren’t perfect, it seemed like he was just being given a rest - or Barrett was being given a game to keep up to speed - when they first made the switch. And then it was Barrett right till the end of the year for no obvious reason at all.
Well there is an obvious reason mate, obviously the coaches thought BB was batter? I am sure everything they do has a reason.
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@Dan54 said in All Blacks v Argentina I:
@ShaquilleOatmeal said in All Blacks v Argentina I:
McKenzie was given a good run of starts and, while things weren’t perfect, it seemed like he was just being given a rest - or Barrett was being given a game to keep up to speed - when they first made the switch. And then it was Barrett right till the end of the year for no obvious reason at all.
Well there is an obvious reason mate, obviously the coaches thought BB was batter? I am sure everything they do has a reason.
Clearly they think BB is better. But I would argue that they are wrong
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If you’re not good enough to start, or be given a shot to start, then you shouldn’t be in the squad.
Only exception is for young players showing future potential.
Thus, if not happy with Ratima or Christie, then Preston starts next week.
This is the All Blacks. Not a jnr or development squad.
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Interestingly, Uncle Laurie thinks Beaudy over DMac - though he doesn't really say why - other than that DMac is predictable in what he does. Which isn't what I'd have thought, but maybe if you watch him more closely than I have he is.
Laurie's got a decent maverick streak to him, though - but, he used to be worth listening to. Haven't seen him pop up for a decade.
Laurie Mains' 'gripe' with All Blacks' mismanagement of Beauden Barrett
The former NZ coach says the All Blacks have been paying the price since 2019 for the decision to remove Barrett from his strongest position.
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@Chris-B said in All Blacks v Argentina I:
Interestingly, Uncle Laurie thinks Beaudy over DMac - though he doesn't really say why - other than that DMac is predictable in what he does. Which isn't what I'd have thought, but maybe if you watch him more closely than I have he is.
Laurie's got a decent maverick streak to him, though - but, he used to be worth listening to. Haven't seen him pop up for a decade.
Laurie Mains' 'gripe' with All Blacks' mismanagement of Beauden Barrett
The former NZ coach says the All Blacks have been paying the price since 2019 for the decision to remove Barrett from his strongest position.
BB was WPOY in 2016/17....8 years ago...and the argument seems to be that he's somehow still more unpredictable...and that's somehow better...
Hopefully we don't hear from Laurie for another decade.
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He's 100% correct that shifting Beauden to 15 and Smith to 14 to accommodate Mo'unga when he was still a rookie was an incredibly poor decision, and I do agree that we've been unsettled at 10 ever since. His comments on DMac being more predictable with what he is going to do is interesting, the Saders did shut him down pretty easily in the final. Beauden probably is more difficult to shut down as he has more of a physical presence ball in hand and has a much more direct running style which is better suited to unlocking defenses at test level.
The big issue is the distance on our kicking game (and the chip kicks, but that's not a Beauden problem, Jordan was the first guilty player trying that on the weekend, so that's gameplan). When we have Ratima starting with Beuaden that really exacerbates the problem. Roigard helps in that regard, but our poor clearances are putting us under a lot of pressure.
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@No-Quarter said in All Blacks v Argentina I:
His comments on DMac being more predictable with what he is going to do is interesting, the Saders did shut him down pretty easily in the final.
As did the Blues in the first week of the finals where Beauden clearly outplayed him.
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@Chris-B said in All Blacks v Argentina I:
Interestingly, Uncle Laurie thinks Beaudy over DMac - though he doesn't really say why - other than that DMac is predictable in what he does. Which isn't what I'd have thought, but maybe if you watch him more closely than I have he is.
Laurie's got a decent maverick streak to him, though - but, he used to be worth listening to. Haven't seen him pop up for a decade.
Laurie Mains' 'gripe' with All Blacks' mismanagement of Beauden Barrett
The former NZ coach says the All Blacks have been paying the price since 2019 for the decision to remove Barrett from his strongest position.
Funny you should post that Chris. I just watched a podcast where Victer Matfield said almost exactly same thing. Reckons he is fantastic 10 and was wasted when he was played at 15. In fact most pundits seem to be on the BB bandwagon, I have seen very few being anti. Another thing is what Matfield was saying about experienced game drivers , and how he thought the Saffas missed that and having one to put their test away on weekend.
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My personal take on dmac and I might be wrong ,
But while it’s a common theory that 10s only play well behind a dominant pack , certain types of 10s that is magnified and becomes more apparent, Carlos was like that as well .
But I wouldn’t be writing him off especially that we are putting together a potential dominant pack. -
@No-Quarter said in All Blacks v Argentina I:
He's 100% correct that shifting Beauden to 15 and Smith to 14 to accommodate Mo'unga when he was still a rookie was an incredibly poor decision, and I do agree that we've been unsettled at 10 ever since. His comments on DMac being more predictable with what he is going to do is interesting, the Saders did shut him down pretty easily in the final. Beauden probably is more difficult to shut down as he has more of a physical presence ball in hand and has a much more direct running style which is better suited to unlocking defenses at test level.
The big issue is the distance on our kicking game (and the chip kicks, but that's not a Beauden problem, Jordan was the first guilty player trying that on the weekend, so that's gameplan). When we have Ratima starting with Beuaden that really exacerbates the problem. Roigard helps in that regard, but our poor clearances are putting us under a lot of pressure.
Interestingly, in Gregor Paul's biography of Hansen he says that the plan in 2019 was to play Beaudy at first-five and DMac at 15 to give them dual play-makers. But, when DMac got injured, to keep the dual playmakers they had to play Richie at 10 and shift Beaudy to 15. Probably, we should have just used a different gameplan - but, a part of the problem was that Hansen abandoned his whole "experience counts" mantra and all of Rieko, Crotty and Ben Smith were watching from the stands - SBW from the bench, while a rookie backline floundered. I think Hansen admitted if he had his time again he'd make different picks - Cane and Ben Smith in particular.
We were pretty settled at 10 from mid-2022 to end of 2023 when Richie took over again. He was clearly number one and good enough to nearly win a World Cup. I'm pretty disappointed that he's that he's preferred to be the six million dollar man rather than Razor's quarterback.
I agree with @Dan54. I'm sure they're not just picking Beaudy on a whim - he's giving them something DMac isn't - or isn't as much. And the Fern seems generally to be particularly harsh on BB compared with other pundits.
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@Chris-B I'm not sure exactly what BB is giving the coaches that DMac wasn't. The last game he started we beat Ireland away,and he was close to man of the match wasn't he? Since then he's not played 10 at all that I can recall. So BB must be an amazing trainer....
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@Chris-B said in All Blacks v Argentina I:
@canefan DMac? He's played a whole season of Super rugby at 10. Sometimes not very well.
But, I kind of struggle to see Beaudy as clearly better. But, I'm prepared to be wrong!
I was talking about AB level. In the last 12 months DMac has been outduelled by Plummer (SR 24 final), BB (SR 25 QF) and Reihana (SR 25 F). Obviously it's not all on him. But he had a good NH tour which apparently doesn't count for much
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@antipodean said in All Blacks v Argentina I:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks v Argentina I:
Finally got to finish a replay. From what i read/heard i was expecting far worse.
It's always worse in real time. For a good 10mins in the second half I thought "ffs, here we go again".
That we didn't was a positive for me.
Been a long 2-3 years, but we do seem to be better at digging ourselves out of mental holes
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@canefan said in All Blacks v Argentina I:
@Chris-B said in All Blacks v Argentina I:
@canefan DMac? He's played a whole season of Super rugby at 10. Sometimes not very well.
But, I kind of struggle to see Beaudy as clearly better. But, I'm prepared to be wrong!
I was talking about AB level. In the last 12 months DMac has been outduelled by Plummer (SR 24 final), BB (SR 25 QF) and Reihana (SR 25 F). Obviously it's not all on him. But he had a good NH tour which apparently doesn't count for much
Annoyingly, the AB stats site has degenerated, so you can't readily find out who played in what in the past two seasons.
But, I think DMac helmed three losses and Beauden just one. Seems like BB is probably about 8/9 at present, so it's not too awful.
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As a
n International Man of Mysterylevel three coach (that's not true) I truly believe the Beauden of Barretts is implementing the gameplan the coaches want. Theshitvaried kicking is to keep the defence guessing, preventing the rush and as a result giving our super talented backs the time and space to express themselves. -
@Bovidae said in All Blacks v Argentina I:
@Chris-B The ABs were losing to England until BB went off with a failed HIA which meant DMac went into 1st 5 and Telea came back on the field to score the winning try.
So you're saying pick Tele'a?
