New All Black Coach
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@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
I personally look at some of the posts here about Kirk being able to fix it with the same trepidation as I had when Razor was announced and everyone was announcing him as the saviour. I certainly hope that Kirk can make enough change to bring the organisation to a professional level of competency, but the same things being said about him as the man to fix things were said about Razor over the last few years.
That's a very fair point, but from what I seen/heard, Kirk is very aware of the issues and understands the need to fix the underlying processes rather than just a short-term fix. He's also an astute businessman who can probably see things from outside the NZR box
A lot is going to depend on who the new CEO is, of course, but at least we now have someone who's prepared to face problems rather than hide them.
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@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
If I were honest, I think it feels like how I would describe much of NZ though, but that's a much longer post and would be well off topic.
Would love for you to elaborate on this - I have felt similar, but I am so far away from NZ, and have been away for so long, that I just don't know if my impression accords with reality.
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I personally look at some of the posts here about Kirk being able to fix it with the same trepidation as I had when Razor was announced and everyone was announcing him as the saviour. I certainly hope that Kirk can make enough change to bring the organisation to a professional level of competency, but the same things being said about him as the man to fix things were said about Razor over the last few years.
Difference with Kirk is he has a proven track record of being a hard arsed and very astute businessman. He was CEO of Fairfax Media in Aussie and worked at McKinsey, and anyone who’s worked with McKinsey knows that most of their graduates are usually ruthless little shits.
Kirk is probably one of the better options NZ rugby has. He also has the social credit of winning a World Cup.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in New All Black Coach:
Actually I don't think it's as difficult as that:
- Be a very, very good rugby coach who will actually coach the ABs
- Be able to communicate clearly to the players and the public
- Have an ability to inspire loyalty in the team and coaching setup
- Don't believe your own social media hype
But David Rennie may meet those criteria! (As that was my point)...
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@Victor-Meldrew said in New All Black Coach:
@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
I personally look at some of the posts here about Kirk being able to fix it with the same trepidation as I had when Razor was announced and everyone was announcing him as the saviour. I certainly hope that Kirk can make enough change to bring the organisation to a professional level of competency, but the same things being said about him as the man to fix things were said about Razor over the last few years.
That's a very fair point, but from what I seen/heard, Kirk is very aware of the issues and understands the need to fix the underlying processes rather than just a short-term fix. He's also an astute businessman who can probably see things from outside the NZR box
A lot is going to depend on who the new CEO is, of course, but at least we now have someone who's prepared to face problems rather than hide them.
I hope for institutional change. But that takes time to implement. While that is happening, we need serious changes to the current coaching group if we are to have any chance in two years, and even more immediate is not getting flogged even worse next season
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@Nepia said in New All Black Coach:
I think @Dan54 might have been around in the 70s when the ABs were losing matches to Baabaas teams on an internal tour. That would have been tough to take.
Apologies Dan if you're not that old.
This year has felt worse for me personally than 98 for the way we lost games, and are playing. I'm as disillusioned with AB rugby in a way I haven't felt since the Mitchell era. And rightly or wrongly I'm more disillusioned than the Fozzie era because we were sold a lemon this time round when we supposed to be getting the messiah.
No insult mate, you bang on. I been following the game since the 60s as I born in 1954, and I have recalled a few times people saying it's all over. As I say I don't disagree we in a flat patch and am pissed at what we seem to be getting, I just perhaps call it a flat patch as dark period (which is also right) just sounds like the end to me!
Hell my Old man always used to say he saw some shit times too, and learnt to wait. He was around when we lost 4-0 to The Boks, lost to Rhodesia for first time and then also lost to Australia for first time ever at Athletic Park. -
@Dan54 said in New All Black Coach:
@Nepia said in New All Black Coach:
I think @Dan54 might have been around in the 70s when the ABs were losing matches to Baabaas teams on an internal tour. That would have been tough to take.
Apologies Dan if you're not that old.
This year has felt worse for me personally than 98 for the way we lost games, and are playing. I'm as disillusioned with AB rugby in a way I haven't felt since the Mitchell era. And rightly or wrongly I'm more disillusioned than the Fozzie era because we were sold a lemon this time round when we supposed to be getting the messiah.
No insult mate, you bang on. I been following the game since the 60s as I born in 1954, and I have recalled a few times people saying it's all over. As I say I don't disagree we in a flat patch and am pissed at what we seem to be getting, I just perhaps call it a flat patch as dark period (which is also right) just sounds like the end to me!
Hell my Old man always used to say he saw some shit times too, and learnt to wait. He was around when we lost 4-0 to The Boks, lost to Rhodesia for first time and then also lost to Australia for first time ever at Athletic Park.From about 2008 to 2017 we have been ridiculously spoiled. That makes the comedown seem even worse
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Make no bones fellas as I said I pissed , and never a fan of Razor getting job, mainly because I think super is so different to test rugby, as you don't have same selection conundrums etc as you tend to work with a certain pool of players. I always remember best coach I worked with (I managed team) here in NZ who after winning 3 club championships got job as Provincial coach, same problems and packed in after a year.
When NZR appointed Razor, although I didn't agree, just as a matter of principle I will support him as I do every AB coach and AB team, so don't take my comments as always being completely happy. -
@canefan said in New All Black Coach:
@Victor-Meldrew said in New All Black Coach:
@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
I personally look at some of the posts here about Kirk being able to fix it with the same trepidation as I had when Razor was announced and everyone was announcing him as the saviour. I certainly hope that Kirk can make enough change to bring the organisation to a professional level of competency, but the same things being said about him as the man to fix things were said about Razor over the last few years.
That's a very fair point, but from what I seen/heard, Kirk is very aware of the issues and understands the need to fix the underlying processes rather than just a short-term fix. He's also an astute businessman who can probably see things from outside the NZR box
A lot is going to depend on who the new CEO is, of course, but at least we now have someone who's prepared to face problems rather than hide them.
I hope for institutional change. But that takes time to implement.
For sure. Problems much deeper than the current coaching setup. At least these are now being aired
While that is happening, we need serious changes to the current coaching group if we are to have any chance in two years, and even more immediate is not getting flogged even worse next season
Tricky situation to handle. If Robertson stays (unlikely to be sacked) and if even 10% of the rumours are true around friction in camp and fall-out with other coaches, then it's going to take a radical overhaul of the coaching setup with some direct day-day control from NZR
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@game_film said in New All Black Coach:
Be interesting to see how Razor would go coaching the ABs when the Scott Hansen era ends.
Yeah will be interesting because he does come across as a guy who likes having his own men that he trusts by his side as opposed to having guys chosen for him. He seems like a man that wants full control.
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@African-Monkey said in New All Black Coach:
@game_film said in New All Black Coach:
Be interesting to see how Razor would go coaching the ABs when the Scott Hansen era ends.
Yeah will be interesting because he does come across as a guy who likes having his own men that he trusts by his side as opposed to having guys chosen for him. He seems like a man that wants full control.
If he wants full control, then why does he let Hansen essentially coach the team?
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@Victor-Meldrew said in New All Black Coach:
@canefan said in New All Black Coach:
@Victor-Meldrew said in New All Black Coach:
@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
I personally look at some of the posts here about Kirk being able to fix it with the same trepidation as I had when Razor was announced and everyone was announcing him as the saviour. I certainly hope that Kirk can make enough change to bring the organisation to a professional level of competency, but the same things being said about him as the man to fix things were said about Razor over the last few years.
That's a very fair point, but from what I seen/heard, Kirk is very aware of the issues and understands the need to fix the underlying processes rather than just a short-term fix. He's also an astute businessman who can probably see things from outside the NZR box
A lot is going to depend on who the new CEO is, of course, but at least we now have someone who's prepared to face problems rather than hide them.
I hope for institutional change. But that takes time to implement.
For sure. Problems much deeper than the current coaching setup. At least these are now being aired
While that is happening, we need serious changes to the current coaching group if we are to have any chance in two years, and even more immediate is not getting flogged even worse next season
Tricky situation to handle. If Robertson stays (unlikely to be sacked) and if even 10% of the rumours are true around friction in camp and fall-out with other coaches, then it's going to take a radical overhaul of the coaching setup with some direct day-day control from NZR
I thought Smith was meant to be an advisor? Either the current coaching team are barely using him, they're not listening to what he tells them, or most unlikely he's telling them bad intel. If Kirk decided these guys needed supervision, it's gotta be someone else, someone who has the power to push change and who has the direct ear of the CEO once appointed. I wonder if GH is free and wants a part time gig?
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@canefan said in New All Black Coach:
@Victor-Meldrew said in New All Black Coach:
@canefan said in New All Black Coach:
@Victor-Meldrew said in New All Black Coach:
@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
I personally look at some of the posts here about Kirk being able to fix it with the same trepidation as I had when Razor was announced and everyone was announcing him as the saviour. I certainly hope that Kirk can make enough change to bring the organisation to a professional level of competency, but the same things being said about him as the man to fix things were said about Razor over the last few years.
That's a very fair point, but from what I seen/heard, Kirk is very aware of the issues and understands the need to fix the underlying processes rather than just a short-term fix. He's also an astute businessman who can probably see things from outside the NZR box
A lot is going to depend on who the new CEO is, of course, but at least we now have someone who's prepared to face problems rather than hide them.
I hope for institutional change. But that takes time to implement.
For sure. Problems much deeper than the current coaching setup. At least these are now being aired
While that is happening, we need serious changes to the current coaching group if we are to have any chance in two years, and even more immediate is not getting flogged even worse next season
Tricky situation to handle. If Robertson stays (unlikely to be sacked) and if even 10% of the rumours are true around friction in camp and fall-out with other coaches, then it's going to take a radical overhaul of the coaching setup with some direct day-day control from NZR
I thought Smith was meant to be an advisor? Either the current coaching team are barely using him, they're not listening to what he tells them, or most unlikely he's telling them bad intel. If Kirk decided these guys needed supervision, it's gotta be someone else, someone who has the power to push change and who has the direct ear of the CEO once appointed. I wonder if GH is free and wants a part time gig?
Precisely. Time to implement the short-leash approach.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in New All Black Coach:
@canefan said in New All Black Coach:
@Victor-Meldrew said in New All Black Coach:
@canefan said in New All Black Coach:
@Victor-Meldrew said in New All Black Coach:
@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
I personally look at some of the posts here about Kirk being able to fix it with the same trepidation as I had when Razor was announced and everyone was announcing him as the saviour. I certainly hope that Kirk can make enough change to bring the organisation to a professional level of competency, but the same things being said about him as the man to fix things were said about Razor over the last few years.
That's a very fair point, but from what I seen/heard, Kirk is very aware of the issues and understands the need to fix the underlying processes rather than just a short-term fix. He's also an astute businessman who can probably see things from outside the NZR box
A lot is going to depend on who the new CEO is, of course, but at least we now have someone who's prepared to face problems rather than hide them.
I hope for institutional change. But that takes time to implement.
For sure. Problems much deeper than the current coaching setup. At least these are now being aired
While that is happening, we need serious changes to the current coaching group if we are to have any chance in two years, and even more immediate is not getting flogged even worse next season
Tricky situation to handle. If Robertson stays (unlikely to be sacked) and if even 10% of the rumours are true around friction in camp and fall-out with other coaches, then it's going to take a radical overhaul of the coaching setup with some direct day-day control from NZR
I thought Smith was meant to be an advisor? Either the current coaching team are barely using him, they're not listening to what he tells them, or most unlikely he's telling them bad intel. If Kirk decided these guys needed supervision, it's gotta be someone else, someone who has the power to push change and who has the direct ear of the CEO once appointed. I wonder if GH is free and wants a part time gig?
Precisely. Time to implement the short-leash approach.
I can't recall the exact timeline. But if memory serves, the Blues weren't great under Thorburn, GH comes on as an advisor and they win the SR title that year? So it can happen fast if you install the right person and give them sufficient clout
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@canefan said in New All Black Coach:
@African-Monkey said in New All Black Coach:
@game_film said in New All Black Coach:
Be interesting to see how Razor would go coaching the ABs when the Scott Hansen era ends.
Yeah will be interesting because he does come across as a guy who likes having his own men that he trusts by his side as opposed to having guys chosen for him. He seems like a man that wants full control.
If he wants full control, then why does he let Hansen essentially coach the team?
His choice though isn't it?
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@African-Monkey said in New All Black Coach:
@canefan said in New All Black Coach:
@African-Monkey said in New All Black Coach:
@game_film said in New All Black Coach:
Be interesting to see how Razor would go coaching the ABs when the Scott Hansen era ends.
Yeah will be interesting because he does come across as a guy who likes having his own men that he trusts by his side as opposed to having guys chosen for him. He seems like a man that wants full control.
If he wants full control, then why does he let Hansen essentially coach the team?
His choice though isn't it?
Yeah I suppose. And his consequences to accept
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When are.they looking to announce the replacement for Holland?
Who are suitable and available candidates?
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@taniwharugby said in New All Black Coach:
When are.they looking to announce the replacement for Holland?
Who are suitable and available candidates?
If I recall they didn't say there definitely would be a replacement. They might just rearrange duties with the guys they've got
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@canefan so rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic...
