Black Caps tour of India
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@MN5 said in Black Caps tour of India:
@canefan said in Black Caps tour of India:
@KiwiPie said in Black Caps tour of India:
Mitchell has really impressed in that tricky number 5 role where you have to play the situation in ODIs. He's prepared to dig in when the top order has failed and either build a decent total when batting first or see it through to the end if batting second. He's built a great international career for someone starting it aged 28.
He's like a Kiwi David Hussey
Well in some ways but he's a fine test player too, poor old Hussey Jr never even got a shot despite an amazing FC record ( 14K runs @ 52 )
As with most analogies, it isn't perfect
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@Virgil said in Black Caps tour of India:
Work is quiet and 99.89% of the fern is focused on some high school All Black drama.....
thats our all time top ODI century scorers to date ( Fleming and Latham also have 8 x 100's)
I'd suggest those 5 pictured would make our all time ODI batting top 5?
Guptill
Astle
Williamson
Taylor
MitchellThats if you're happy to leave out Turner and Crowe
With all due respect to Nathan Astle, he's not even close to those guys. Guptill too.
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@reprobate said in Black Caps tour of India:
@Virgil said in Black Caps tour of India:
Work is quiet and 99.89% of the fern is focused on some high school All Black drama.....
thats our all time top ODI century scorers to date ( Fleming and Latham also have 8 x 100's)
I'd suggest those 5 pictured would make our all time ODI batting top 5?
Guptill
Astle
Williamson
Taylor
MitchellThats if you're happy to leave out Turner and Crowe
With all due respect to Nathan Astle, he's not even close to those guys. Guptill too.
Astle played in an era where mid 30s was a very good ODI average
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@reprobate said in Black Caps tour of India:
@Virgil said in Black Caps tour of India:
Work is quiet and 99.89% of the fern is focused on some high school All Black drama.....
thats our all time top ODI century scorers to date ( Fleming and Latham also have 8 x 100's)
I'd suggest those 5 pictured would make our all time ODI batting top 5?
Guptill
Astle
Williamson
Taylor
MitchellThats if you're happy to leave out Turner and Crowe
With all due respect to Nathan Astle, he's not even close to those guys. Guptill too.
yeah nah have to hard disagree there.
Had a dig into Astles 100's
14 of them came in wins.As mentioned the game was different in his time.
its not like he couldnt bat at an outrageous pace, still holds the test record for the fastest test double hundred after all.Guptill had his issues, wasnt always consistent but not many ODI openers have an average over 40.00
he's a shoe in to open for me. -
@MN5 said in Black Caps tour of India:
@reprobate said in Black Caps tour of India:
@Virgil said in Black Caps tour of India:
Work is quiet and 99.89% of the fern is focused on some high school All Black drama.....
thats our all time top ODI century scorers to date ( Fleming and Latham also have 8 x 100's)
I'd suggest those 5 pictured would make our all time ODI batting top 5?
Guptill
Astle
Williamson
Taylor
MitchellThats if you're happy to leave out Turner and Crowe
With all due respect to Nathan Astle, he's not even close to those guys. Guptill too.
Astle played in an era where mid 30s was a very good ODI average
Oh I've seen them play bro - admittedly Turner not so much. But Crowe vs Astle? pfft. Ask any bowler. I'd still say it's not even close even if it were an absolute road for every game guaranteed - they're just not in the same class at all.
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@Virgil said in Black Caps tour of India:
@reprobate said in Black Caps tour of India:
@Virgil said in Black Caps tour of India:
Work is quiet and 99.89% of the fern is focused on some high school All Black drama.....
thats our all time top ODI century scorers to date ( Fleming and Latham also have 8 x 100's)
I'd suggest those 5 pictured would make our all time ODI batting top 5?
Guptill
Astle
Williamson
Taylor
MitchellThats if you're happy to leave out Turner and Crowe
With all due respect to Nathan Astle, he's not even close to those guys. Guptill too.
yeah nah have to hard disagree there.
Had a dig into Astles 100's
14 of them came in wins.As mentioned the game was different in his time.
its not like he couldnt bat at an outrageous pace, still holds the test record for the fastest test double hundred after all.Guptill had his issues, wasnt always consistent but not many ODI openers have an average over 40.00
he's a shoe in to open for me.Yep, biggest one being test Cricket.
But ODIs ? absolutely walks in. Fantastic record.
Crowe vs Astle is a bloody tough one, there's room for both.....but then check Glenn Turners ODI average ESPECIALLY in that era ?!?!?! ( much smaller sample size counts against him )
McCullum keeps and bats seven then Vettori, Hadlee, Bond and Boult. Easy.
Astle and Mitch share 10 overs between them with the ball.
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@MN5 said in Black Caps tour of India:
@Virgil said in Black Caps tour of India:
@reprobate said in Black Caps tour of India:
@Virgil said in Black Caps tour of India:
Work is quiet and 99.89% of the fern is focused on some high school All Black drama.....
thats our all time top ODI century scorers to date ( Fleming and Latham also have 8 x 100's)
I'd suggest those 5 pictured would make our all time ODI batting top 5?
Guptill
Astle
Williamson
Taylor
MitchellThats if you're happy to leave out Turner and Crowe
With all due respect to Nathan Astle, he's not even close to those guys. Guptill too.
yeah nah have to hard disagree there.
Had a dig into Astles 100's
14 of them came in wins.As mentioned the game was different in his time.
its not like he couldnt bat at an outrageous pace, still holds the test record for the fastest test double hundred after all.Guptill had his issues, wasnt always consistent but not many ODI openers have an average over 40.00
he's a shoe in to open for me.Yep, biggest one being test Cricket.
But ODIs ? absolutely walks in. Fantastic record.
Crowe vs Astle is a bloody tough one, there's room for both.....but then check Glenn Turners ODI average ESPECIALLY in that era ?!?!?! ( much smaller sample size counts against him )
McCullum keeps and bats seven then Vettori, Hadlee, Bond and Boult. Easy.
Astle and Mitch share 10 overs between them with the ball.
If we're in what-if world, Marty is the better bowler too bro.
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@reprobate said in Black Caps tour of India:
@MN5 said in Black Caps tour of India:
@Virgil said in Black Caps tour of India:
@reprobate said in Black Caps tour of India:
@Virgil said in Black Caps tour of India:
Work is quiet and 99.89% of the fern is focused on some high school All Black drama.....
thats our all time top ODI century scorers to date ( Fleming and Latham also have 8 x 100's)
I'd suggest those 5 pictured would make our all time ODI batting top 5?
Guptill
Astle
Williamson
Taylor
MitchellThats if you're happy to leave out Turner and Crowe
With all due respect to Nathan Astle, he's not even close to those guys. Guptill too.
yeah nah have to hard disagree there.
Had a dig into Astles 100's
14 of them came in wins.As mentioned the game was different in his time.
its not like he couldnt bat at an outrageous pace, still holds the test record for the fastest test double hundred after all.Guptill had his issues, wasnt always consistent but not many ODI openers have an average over 40.00
he's a shoe in to open for me.Yep, biggest one being test Cricket.
But ODIs ? absolutely walks in. Fantastic record.
Crowe vs Astle is a bloody tough one, there's room for both.....but then check Glenn Turners ODI average ESPECIALLY in that era ?!?!?! ( much smaller sample size counts against him )
McCullum keeps and bats seven then Vettori, Hadlee, Bond and Boult. Easy.
Astle and Mitch share 10 overs between them with the ball.
If we're in what-if world, Marty is the better bowler too bro.
whether that's accurate or not ( Astle was very useful ) is neither here nor there, he can share the 10 overs too.
Astle
Guptill
KW
Crowe
Taylor
Mitchell
McCullum
Hadlee
Vettori
Bond
BoultI'm bloody happy with that team ! not sure who I'd have captain, there's a few options.
Matt Henry probably unluckiest to miss out......
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Helped by the ability of both Astle and Mitchell to bowl a few overs if needed
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While I think Astle's batting would translate pretty well to today's game, I reckon his bowling wouldn't. I can't recall seeing any slow bowlers like him going around at the moment. Slow bowlers seem to be spinners nowadays. Even Mitchell is a bit quicker than Astle was.
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@Virgil said in Black Caps tour of India:
Helped by the ability of both Astle and Mitchell to bowl a few overs if needed
Yep, and my team actually has specialists ( even though Paddles and Vettori can certainly bat )
No room for part rounders in the final XI but guys who can turn the arm over when needed.
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Astle averaged close to 40 as a bowler, and Mitch isn't much better. I don't think opening is as much of a specialist role as it is in tests. I'd drop Astle for Cairns and have Cairns batting 6 with everyone else moving up one (so KW opening - he's been pretty good at it in T20).
I was looking at NZ bowlers ODI averages the other day and Chris Pringle was a remarkably effective ODI bowler. Different eras and all that (defending 2 runs in a final over is surely impossible now) but got to give him an honourable mention.
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@Cyclops said in Black Caps tour of India:
Astle averaged close to 40 as a bowler, and Mitch isn't much better. I don't think opening is as much of a specialist role as it is in tests. I'd drop Astle for Cairns and have Cairns batting 6 with everyone else moving up one (so KW opening - he's been pretty good at it in T20).
I was looking at NZ bowlers ODI averages the other day and Chris Pringle was a remarkably effective ODI bowler. Different eras and all that (defending 2 runs in a final over is surely impossible now) but got to give him an honourable mention.
From memory Pringle was an early pioneer of the slower ball. It developed into a weapon for him.
Didn't he get a start after turning up to training as a net bowler? Not on anyone's radar, but he impressed so much they gave him a go (injuries may have helped his cause too)
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@Crazy-Horse said in Black Caps tour of India:
@Cyclops said in Black Caps tour of India:
Astle averaged close to 40 as a bowler, and Mitch isn't much better. I don't think opening is as much of a specialist role as it is in tests. I'd drop Astle for Cairns and have Cairns batting 6 with everyone else moving up one (so KW opening - he's been pretty good at it in T20).
I was looking at NZ bowlers ODI averages the other day and Chris Pringle was a remarkably effective ODI bowler. Different eras and all that (defending 2 runs in a final over is surely impossible now) but got to give him an honourable mention.
From memory Pringle was an early pioneer of the slower ball. It developed into a weapon for him.
Didn't he get a start after turning up to training as a net bowler? Not on anyone's radar, but he impressed so much they gave him a go (injuries may have helped his cause too)
This will live long in the memory. Definitely helped by Bruce Reid being almost Chris Martin standard with the bat.
Pringle despite taking 11/152 in his third test ( with some liberal tampering of the ball apparently ) never really cut it in the longest form but he was terrific in ODIs. On the shortlist for an all time team.
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@MN5 said in Black Caps tour of India:
@reprobate said in Black Caps tour of India:
@MN5 said in Black Caps tour of India:
@Virgil said in Black Caps tour of India:
@reprobate said in Black Caps tour of India:
@Virgil said in Black Caps tour of India:
Work is quiet and 99.89% of the fern is focused on some high school All Black drama.....
thats our all time top ODI century scorers to date ( Fleming and Latham also have 8 x 100's)
I'd suggest those 5 pictured would make our all time ODI batting top 5?
Guptill
Astle
Williamson
Taylor
MitchellThats if you're happy to leave out Turner and Crowe
With all due respect to Nathan Astle, he's not even close to those guys. Guptill too.
yeah nah have to hard disagree there.
Had a dig into Astles 100's
14 of them came in wins.As mentioned the game was different in his time.
its not like he couldnt bat at an outrageous pace, still holds the test record for the fastest test double hundred after all.Guptill had his issues, wasnt always consistent but not many ODI openers have an average over 40.00
he's a shoe in to open for me.Yep, biggest one being test Cricket.
But ODIs ? absolutely walks in. Fantastic record.
Crowe vs Astle is a bloody tough one, there's room for both.....but then check Glenn Turners ODI average ESPECIALLY in that era ?!?!?! ( much smaller sample size counts against him )
McCullum keeps and bats seven then Vettori, Hadlee, Bond and Boult. Easy.
Astle and Mitch share 10 overs between them with the ball.
If we're in what-if world, Marty is the better bowler too bro.
whether that's accurate or not ( Astle was very useful ) is neither here nor there, he can share the 10 overs too.
Astle
Guptill
KW
Crowe
Taylor
Mitchell
McCullum
Hadlee
Vettori
Bond
BoultI'm bloody happy with that team ! not sure who I'd have captain, there's a few options.
Matt Henry probably unluckiest to miss out......
should be noted Henry currently has a better strike rate then Bond does
28.75 vs 29.21
Not alot in that of course, Bond had a superior average and a tad more paceAnother guy to mention is Kyle Mills who seems forgotten about
Our 2nd all time wicket taker in ODI's with 240 wickets. 27 average and SR of 34 which is handy.
Very good economy rate of 4.72 -
@Virgil said in Black Caps tour of India:
@MN5 said in Black Caps tour of India:
@reprobate said in Black Caps tour of India:
@MN5 said in Black Caps tour of India:
@Virgil said in Black Caps tour of India:
@reprobate said in Black Caps tour of India:
@Virgil said in Black Caps tour of India:
Work is quiet and 99.89% of the fern is focused on some high school All Black drama.....
thats our all time top ODI century scorers to date ( Fleming and Latham also have 8 x 100's)
I'd suggest those 5 pictured would make our all time ODI batting top 5?
Guptill
Astle
Williamson
Taylor
MitchellThats if you're happy to leave out Turner and Crowe
With all due respect to Nathan Astle, he's not even close to those guys. Guptill too.
yeah nah have to hard disagree there.
Had a dig into Astles 100's
14 of them came in wins.As mentioned the game was different in his time.
its not like he couldnt bat at an outrageous pace, still holds the test record for the fastest test double hundred after all.Guptill had his issues, wasnt always consistent but not many ODI openers have an average over 40.00
he's a shoe in to open for me.Yep, biggest one being test Cricket.
But ODIs ? absolutely walks in. Fantastic record.
Crowe vs Astle is a bloody tough one, there's room for both.....but then check Glenn Turners ODI average ESPECIALLY in that era ?!?!?! ( much smaller sample size counts against him )
McCullum keeps and bats seven then Vettori, Hadlee, Bond and Boult. Easy.
Astle and Mitch share 10 overs between them with the ball.
If we're in what-if world, Marty is the better bowler too bro.
whether that's accurate or not ( Astle was very useful ) is neither here nor there, he can share the 10 overs too.
Astle
Guptill
KW
Crowe
Taylor
Mitchell
McCullum
Hadlee
Vettori
Bond
BoultI'm bloody happy with that team ! not sure who I'd have captain, there's a few options.
Matt Henry probably unluckiest to miss out......
should be noted Henry currently has a better strike rate then Bond does
28.75 vs 29.21
Not alot in that of course, Bond had a superior average and a tad more paceAnother guy to mention is Kyle Mills who seems forgotten about
Our 2nd all time wicket taker in ODI's with 240 wickets. 27 average and SR of 34 which is handy.
Very good economy rate of 4.72Yep all excellent points.
Paddles played in the infancy of ODIs but I have no doubt he’d adjust to whatever demands were placed on him.
Automatic selection.
Bonds BMT was outstanding. Didn’t realise quite how close he was to Henry statistically.
Boult gets in based on class and longevity.
Easy to forget Kyle Mills was brilliant too.
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Allot was very good, shame he only played 31 games
Stats are top notch, 52 wickets @ 23.21 and SR @ 29.38interesting fun fact, only 2 Black Caps have a Strike Rate under 25 (at least 20 wickets)
One is currently in the side with 35 wicketsthe other took 60 wickets
any guess who they are without cheating?
the 2nd one is a bit surprising, not a front line bowler. -
I think Guptill, KW, Taylor, M Crowe, Hadlee and Vettori are certainties.
McCullum is a certainty but can either be a keeper and bat 6 or 7, or an opener. If opening, could make him keep anyway or select Smith as keeper and #9 batter (good SR, would be useful late).
If McCullum is 6 or 7, Astle is probably the next best opener. If McCullum opens, C Cairns could play and bat 6.
Bond and Boult round out a nice 11, but could be tricky deciding who opens the bowling with Hadlee.
