All Blacks 2026
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@Jet said in All Blacks 2026:
The true Allblack healing will begin in the post Ardie and post Beaudy world.
Old favourites of mine, but they upset the balance of the forwards and backs respectively.
It's like when PSG had Messi, Mbappe and Neymar upfront.
Highlight reel players who didn't do any work off the ball.PSG got rid of them all and then won the champions league with young up and comers and industrious midfielders like Vitinha and Fabian Ruiz.
I'm only guessing. But if Ardie and BB were only interested in starting, what reason would they have to complain? Perhaps they want to win and saw that the coaching team weren't providing the environment they believed would achieve this, and that they were not willing to work with the players to change it? They weren't the only ones remember, half of the squad voiced their concerns. Perhaps they will be happy to play lesser roles if solid team structure and systems are there?
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@tubbyj said in All Blacks 2026:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2026:
@tubbyj said in All Blacks 2026:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2026:
@tubbyj said in All Blacks 2026:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2026:
@tubbyj said in All Blacks 2026:
No I am saying that Ardie should have been just as damning of Foster not saying "hes my coach and I have his back" if he was consistent and not one of the single biggest problems in the team culture himself.
??
Maybe because Ardie wasn't ignored by the Head Coach when he had problems/concerns
Are you saying the All Blacks should not be about test results but making Ardie Savea feel listened to and important?
I'm saying a really shit coach treats his players like shit and creates a toxic culture where players simply give up trying - which is what we've seen this year.
Are you saying there are no example of coaches treating players like shit and keeping the culture on edge that have not produced wildly successful results?
If Razor had produced wildly successful results he would still be in a job
Where did I disagree with that? I am asking why Ardie Savea didn't want Ian Foster fired for producing equally dire results.
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2026:
@tubbyj said in All Blacks 2026:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2026:
@tubbyj said in All Blacks 2026:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2026:
@tubbyj said in All Blacks 2026:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2026:
@tubbyj said in All Blacks 2026:
No I am saying that Ardie should have been just as damning of Foster not saying "hes my coach and I have his back" if he was consistent and not one of the single biggest problems in the team culture himself.
??
Maybe because Ardie wasn't ignored by the Head Coach when he had problems/concerns
Are you saying the All Blacks should not be about test results but making Ardie Savea feel listened to and important?
I'm saying a really shit coach treats his players like shit and creates a toxic culture where players simply give up trying - which is what we've seen this year.
Are you saying there are no example of coaches treating players like shit and keeping the culture on edge that have not produced wildly successful results?
If Razor had produced wildly successful results he would still be in a job
Where did I disagree with that? I am asking why Ardie Savea didn't want Ian Foster fired for producing equally dire results.
And we answered that changes occurred. Plumtree and Moaar got canned. We are going around in circles.
And that it wasn't JUST the results.
Agree with the circles.
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@canefan said in All Blacks 2026:
@Jet said in All Blacks 2026:
The true Allblack healing will begin in the post Ardie and post Beaudy world.
Old favourites of mine, but they upset the balance of the forwards and backs respectively.
It's like when PSG had Messi, Mbappe and Neymar upfront.
Highlight reel players who didn't do any work off the ball.PSG got rid of them all and then won the champions league with young up and comers and industrious midfielders like Vitinha and Fabian Ruiz.
I'm only guessing. But if Ardie and BB were only interested in starting, what reason would they have to complain? Perhaps they want to win and saw that the coaching team weren't providing the environment they believed would achieve this, and that they were not willing to work with the players to change it? They weren't the only ones remember, half of the squad voiced their concerns. Perhaps they will be happy to play lesser roles if solid team structure and systems are there?
Could you please point out a time where Beauden and Savea have led a team to success? I’m not entirely sure their opinion means anything when they don’t know how to do it? I am really not sure why anyone is defending those two at all?
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@jimmyb said in All Blacks 2026:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2026:
@Jet said in All Blacks 2026:
The true Allblack healing will begin in the post Ardie and post Beaudy world.
Old favourites of mine, but they upset the balance of the forwards and backs respectively.
It's like when PSG had Messi, Mbappe and Neymar upfront.
Highlight reel players who didn't do any work off the ball.PSG got rid of them all and then won the champions league with young up and comers and industrious midfielders like Vitinha and Fabian Ruiz.
I'm only guessing. But if Ardie and BB were only interested in starting, what reason would they have to complain? Perhaps they want to win and saw that the coaching team weren't providing the environment they believed would achieve this, and that they were not willing to work with the players to change it? They weren't the only ones remember, half of the squad voiced their concerns. Perhaps they will be happy to play lesser roles if solid team structure and systems are there?
Could you please point out a time where Beauden and Savea have led a team to success? I’m not entirely sure their opinion means anything when they don’t know how to do it? I am really not sure why anyone is defending those two at all?
I can't argue with you so I won't bother.
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@gt12 said in All Blacks 2026:
I think we are getting a touch of what Canterbury / Crusaders social media looks like right now.
Ignore them. You could present all the facts infront of them and they'd still try and say that Razor deserved better. The term 'one eyed' exists for a reason with them.
Kind of feels good this. Feel like poor performance won't be tolerated anymore. Obviously we'll have to wait for the first side of the year to be announced but yeah, this feels good.
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@jimmyb said in All Blacks 2026:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2026:
@Jet said in All Blacks 2026:
The true Allblack healing will begin in the post Ardie and post Beaudy world.
Old favourites of mine, but they upset the balance of the forwards and backs respectively.
It's like when PSG had Messi, Mbappe and Neymar upfront.
Highlight reel players who didn't do any work off the ball.PSG got rid of them all and then won the champions league with young up and comers and industrious midfielders like Vitinha and Fabian Ruiz.
I'm only guessing. But if Ardie and BB were only interested in starting, what reason would they have to complain? Perhaps they want to win and saw that the coaching team weren't providing the environment they believed would achieve this, and that they were not willing to work with the players to change it? They weren't the only ones remember, half of the squad voiced their concerns. Perhaps they will be happy to play lesser roles if solid team structure and systems are there?
Could you please point out a time where Beauden and Savea have led a team to success? I’m not entirely sure their opinion means anything when they don’t know how to do it? I am really not sure why anyone is defending those two at all?
How many here would choose Barrett to start for the ABs?
Very few, except the Razor coaching regime who put him at 10 even when he was literally on one leg.How many here would choose Ardie Savea? Maybe more, but most would like him on the bench. Of course, the Razor coaching regime put him at 7 and made him captain at times.
If their (e.g., Ardie, Barrett) opinion matters, and based on stuff we've heard from Kirk, things were very measured in the way that they went about discussing the AB legacy, then it would be because these are two of the key starting players in key positions - as selected by the previous coaching team. The Razor coaching team choices!
It's not clear to me why the review wouldn't focus on the players who are starting in the key positions, who also happen to be part of the leadership team.
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@jimmyb said in All Blacks 2026:
This is obviously a resounding positive and the best move NZ rugby could have done. I am not sure however about the somewhat revisionist comments that this shit show is entirely on Robertson’s shoulders
Clearly losing the dressing room is entirely down to Robertson - the one key thing any coach is responsible for.
Robertson’s greatest failing behind his obvious poor player management style, was trying to polish a turd that had been there for 8-9 years. Not completely cleaning house was a mistake.
Agree. Lack of Test experience meant he lacked the smarts to do that. Understandable in the first year, but not in the second. A lot of that is down to NZR wanting their man in charge and not having much of strategy for choosing the coaching group as a whole.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2026:
@jimmyb said in All Blacks 2026:
This is obviously a resounding positive and the best move NZ rugby could have done. I am not sure however about the somewhat revisionist comments that this shit show is entirely on Robertson’s shoulders
Clearly losing the dressing room is entirely down to Robertson - the one key thing any coach is responsible for.
Robertson’s greatest failing behind his obvious poor player management style, was trying to polish a turd that had been there for 8-9 years. Not completely cleaning house was a mistake.
Agree. Lack of Test experience meant he lacked the smarts to do that. Understandable in the first year, but not in the second. A lot of that is down to NZR wanting their man in charge and not having much of strategy for choosing the coaching group as a whole.
Yes losing the dressing room is entirely the coaches fault. But what I was referring to more generally was the results and culture. Big part Robertson, big part the players
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@jimmyb said in All Blacks 2026:
Could you please point out a time where Beauden and Savea have led a team to success? I’m not entirely sure their opinion means anything when they don’t know how to do it? I am really not sure why anyone is defending those two at all?
Barrett has one more (insert here; GOLD) RWC Cup medal around his neck than I do, scored a try in the final if I recall correctly. You'll have to ask a Canes fan to confirm but I think he was also pretty important in 2016 when they won Super Rugby. 20-3 I think?
Savea, according to AI:
"Moana Pasifika: In the 2025 Super Rugby Pacific season, as captain, Savea led Moana Pasifika to their most successful campaign to date, securing six wins and nearly making their first-ever playoffs appearance. His leadership was widely credited for the team's significant improvement.
Hurricanes: He was part of the Hurricanes' 2016 Super Rugby title-winning team. He later became the team's captain in 2021.
Wellington: Savea captained his Wellington provincial side during the 2015 ITM Cup season, leading them to the Championship division final.
Junior Levels: His leadership qualities were evident from a young age, as he captained his First XV school team and the New Zealand Schools team to victories.""Major Individual Awards (Cups):
World Rugby Player of the Year: 2023 (the sport's highest individual award).
Kelvin R. Tremain Memorial Player of the Year (NZ Rugby): 2019, 2023, 2025.
All Blacks Player of the Year: 2019, 2021, 2022, 2023, 2025.
Super Rugby Pacific Player of the Year: 2025 (for Moana Pasifika)." -
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2026:
@jimmyb said in All Blacks 2026:
Could you please point out a time where Beauden and Savea have led a team to success? I’m not entirely sure their opinion means anything when they don’t know how to do it? I am really not sure why anyone is defending those two at all?
Barrett has one more RWC Cup medal around his neck than I do, scored a try in the final if I recall correctly. You'll have to ask a Canes fan to confirm but I think he was also pretty important in 2016 when they won Super Rugby. 20-3 I think?
Savea, according to AI:
"Moana Pasifika: In the 2025 Super Rugby Pacific season, as captain, Savea led Moana Pasifika to their most successful campaign to date, securing six wins and nearly making their first-ever playoffs appearance. His leadership was widely credited for the team's significant improvement.
Hurricanes: He was part of the Hurricanes' 2016 Super Rugby title-winning team. He later became the team's captain in 2021.
Wellington: Savea captained his Wellington provincial side during the 2015 ITM Cup season, leading them to the Championship division final.
Junior Levels: His leadership qualities were evident from a young age, as he captained his First XV school team and the New Zealand Schools team to victories.""Major Individual Awards (Cups):
World Rugby Player of the Year: 2023 (the sport's highest individual award).
Kelvin R. Tremain Memorial Player of the Year (NZ Rugby): 2019, 2023, 2025.
All Blacks Player of the Year: 2019, 2021, 2022, 2023, 2025.
Super Rugby Pacific Player of the Year: 2025 (for Moana Pasifika)."They are the two whipping boys that planet Red n Black will focus their ire on. But the few Cantab supporters that I know weren't entirely happy with his performance as early as the mid year tests of 2025. I'd suspect there were many more
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@canefan said in All Blacks 2026:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2026:
@jimmyb said in All Blacks 2026:
Could you please point out a time where Beauden and Savea have led a team to success? I’m not entirely sure their opinion means anything when they don’t know how to do it? I am really not sure why anyone is defending those two at all?
Barrett has one more RWC Cup medal around his neck than I do, scored a try in the final if I recall correctly. You'll have to ask a Canes fan to confirm but I think he was also pretty important in 2016 when they won Super Rugby. 20-3 I think?
Savea, according to AI:
"Moana Pasifika: In the 2025 Super Rugby Pacific season, as captain, Savea led Moana Pasifika to their most successful campaign to date, securing six wins and nearly making their first-ever playoffs appearance. His leadership was widely credited for the team's significant improvement.
Hurricanes: He was part of the Hurricanes' 2016 Super Rugby title-winning team. He later became the team's captain in 2021.
Wellington: Savea captained his Wellington provincial side during the 2015 ITM Cup season, leading them to the Championship division final.
Junior Levels: His leadership qualities were evident from a young age, as he captained his First XV school team and the New Zealand Schools team to victories.""Major Individual Awards (Cups):
World Rugby Player of the Year: 2023 (the sport's highest individual award).
Kelvin R. Tremain Memorial Player of the Year (NZ Rugby): 2019, 2023, 2025.
All Blacks Player of the Year: 2019, 2021, 2022, 2023, 2025.
Super Rugby Pacific Player of the Year: 2025 (for Moana Pasifika)."They are the two whipping boys that planet Red n Black will focus their ire on. But the few Cantab supporters that I know weren't entirely happy with his performance as early as the mid year tests of 2025. I'd suspect there were many more
This whole conversation is dumb as fuck anyway. We didn't fucking select those guys, Razor and his team did.
That's totally apart from the fact that the review wasn't with two fucking players.
Also totally apart from the fact that there are sources, from here, detailing the poor environment, so why wouldn't players speak up when the yearly review is part of their role?
@African-Monkey was right, we should ignore it. I wish I had.
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@mohikamo said in All Blacks 2026:
@gt12 said in All Blacks 2026:
I think we are getting a touch of what Canterbury / Crusaders social media looks like right now.
I reckon.
Looks like they are beginning a SM counter-offensive.
But they got nuttin.I can't speak for everyone else. But I really wanted Razor to work out. And it gives me no pleasure to see it end like this. But he came in on an unprecedented wave of goodwill, had the Professor available as an advisor, and only has himself to blame for the way this has gone down
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@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2026:
@jimmyb said in All Blacks 2026:
Could you please point out a time where Beauden and Savea have led a team to success? I’m not entirely sure their opinion means anything when they don’t know how to do it? I am really not sure why anyone is defending those two at all?
Barrett has one more RWC Cup medal around his neck than I do, scored a try in the final if I recall correctly. You'll have to ask a Canes fan to confirm but I think he was also pretty important in 2016 when they won Super Rugby. 20-3 I think?
Savea, according to AI:
"Moana Pasifika: In the 2025 Super Rugby Pacific season, as captain, Savea led Moana Pasifika to their most successful campaign to date, securing six wins and nearly making their first-ever playoffs appearance. His leadership was widely credited for the team's significant improvement.
Hurricanes: He was part of the Hurricanes' 2016 Super Rugby title-winning team. He later became the team's captain in 2021.
Wellington: Savea captained his Wellington provincial side during the 2015 ITM Cup season, leading them to the Championship division final.
Junior Levels: His leadership qualities were evident from a young age, as he captained his First XV school team and the New Zealand Schools team to victories.""Major Individual Awards (Cups):
World Rugby Player of the Year: 2023 (the sport's highest individual award).
Kelvin R. Tremain Memorial Player of the Year (NZ Rugby): 2019, 2023, 2025.
All Blacks Player of the Year: 2019, 2021, 2022, 2023, 2025.
Super Rugby Pacific Player of the Year: 2025 (for Moana Pasifika)."So only the last five mins of the RWC final in the greatest team of all time, scoring a try in garage time when the game was won. One super rugby title 10 years ago. Nothing since
Again, Savea, nothing since the start of his super rugby career. Not the leader, not the main player.
If anything, you’ve proved my point. No international success as leaders. Nothing in the past 3-4 years
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@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2026:
Some people on here have so much hindsight I wonder if they have any normal sight left.
Actually, apart from a few Robertson-fluffing loons, there is very little. Plenty of goodwill and hoping things turned out well, but clearly willing to judge on progress
forum.silverfern.rugby/topic/5884/it-s-razor-robertson-new-all-blacks-coach
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Is Tony Brown free to join as an assistant coach?
The added bonus of him coaching the AB’s is that it also takes him away from SA where he has been vital in there success.
I wonder if denying SA his talents will play any part in NZRs thinking? -
@jimmyb said in All Blacks 2026:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2026:
@jimmyb said in All Blacks 2026:
Could you please point out a time where Beauden and Savea have led a team to success? I’m not entirely sure their opinion means anything when they don’t know how to do it? I am really not sure why anyone is defending those two at all?
Barrett has one more RWC Cup medal around his neck than I do, scored a try in the final if I recall correctly. You'll have to ask a Canes fan to confirm but I think he was also pretty important in 2016 when they won Super Rugby. 20-3 I think?
Savea, according to AI:
"Moana Pasifika: In the 2025 Super Rugby Pacific season, as captain, Savea led Moana Pasifika to their most successful campaign to date, securing six wins and nearly making their first-ever playoffs appearance. His leadership was widely credited for the team's significant improvement.
Hurricanes: He was part of the Hurricanes' 2016 Super Rugby title-winning team. He later became the team's captain in 2021.
Wellington: Savea captained his Wellington provincial side during the 2015 ITM Cup season, leading them to the Championship division final.
Junior Levels: His leadership qualities were evident from a young age, as he captained his First XV school team and the New Zealand Schools team to victories.""Major Individual Awards (Cups):
World Rugby Player of the Year: 2023 (the sport's highest individual award).
Kelvin R. Tremain Memorial Player of the Year (NZ Rugby): 2019, 2023, 2025.
All Blacks Player of the Year: 2019, 2021, 2022, 2023, 2025.
Super Rugby Pacific Player of the Year: 2025 (for Moana Pasifika)."So only the last five mins of the RWC final in the greatest team of all time, scoring a try in garage time when the game was won. One super rugby title 10 years ago. Nothing since
Again, Savea, nothing since the start of his super rugby career. Not the leader, not the main player.
If anything, you’ve proved my point. No international success as leaders. Nothing in the past 3-4 years
Makes you wonder why Robertson kept selecting them, eh?
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2026:
@jimmyb said in All Blacks 2026:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2026:
@jimmyb said in All Blacks 2026:
Could you please point out a time where Beauden and Savea have led a team to success? I’m not entirely sure their opinion means anything when they don’t know how to do it? I am really not sure why anyone is defending those two at all?
Barrett has one more RWC Cup medal around his neck than I do, scored a try in the final if I recall correctly. You'll have to ask a Canes fan to confirm but I think he was also pretty important in 2016 when they won Super Rugby. 20-3 I think?
Savea, according to AI:
"Moana Pasifika: In the 2025 Super Rugby Pacific season, as captain, Savea led Moana Pasifika to their most successful campaign to date, securing six wins and nearly making their first-ever playoffs appearance. His leadership was widely credited for the team's significant improvement.
Hurricanes: He was part of the Hurricanes' 2016 Super Rugby title-winning team. He later became the team's captain in 2021.
Wellington: Savea captained his Wellington provincial side during the 2015 ITM Cup season, leading them to the Championship division final.
Junior Levels: His leadership qualities were evident from a young age, as he captained his First XV school team and the New Zealand Schools team to victories.""Major Individual Awards (Cups):
World Rugby Player of the Year: 2023 (the sport's highest individual award).
Kelvin R. Tremain Memorial Player of the Year (NZ Rugby): 2019, 2023, 2025.
All Blacks Player of the Year: 2019, 2021, 2022, 2023, 2025.
Super Rugby Pacific Player of the Year: 2025 (for Moana Pasifika)."So only the last five mins of the RWC final in the greatest team of all time, scoring a try in garage time when the game was won. One super rugby title 10 years ago. Nothing since
Again, Savea, nothing since the start of his super rugby career. Not the leader, not the main player.
If anything, you’ve proved my point. No international success as leaders. Nothing in the past 3-4 years
Makes you wonder why Robertson kept selecting them, eh?
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2026:
@jimmyb said in All Blacks 2026:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2026:
@jimmyb said in All Blacks 2026:
Could you please point out a time where Beauden and Savea have led a team to success? I’m not entirely sure their opinion means anything when they don’t know how to do it? I am really not sure why anyone is defending those two at all?
Barrett has one more RWC Cup medal around his neck than I do, scored a try in the final if I recall correctly. You'll have to ask a Canes fan to confirm but I think he was also pretty important in 2016 when they won Super Rugby. 20-3 I think?
Savea, according to AI:
"Moana Pasifika: In the 2025 Super Rugby Pacific season, as captain, Savea led Moana Pasifika to their most successful campaign to date, securing six wins and nearly making their first-ever playoffs appearance. His leadership was widely credited for the team's significant improvement.
Hurricanes: He was part of the Hurricanes' 2016 Super Rugby title-winning team. He later became the team's captain in 2021.
Wellington: Savea captained his Wellington provincial side during the 2015 ITM Cup season, leading them to the Championship division final.
Junior Levels: His leadership qualities were evident from a young age, as he captained his First XV school team and the New Zealand Schools team to victories.""Major Individual Awards (Cups):
World Rugby Player of the Year: 2023 (the sport's highest individual award).
Kelvin R. Tremain Memorial Player of the Year (NZ Rugby): 2019, 2023, 2025.
All Blacks Player of the Year: 2019, 2021, 2022, 2023, 2025.
Super Rugby Pacific Player of the Year: 2025 (for Moana Pasifika)."So only the last five mins of the RWC final in the greatest team of all time, scoring a try in garage time when the game was won. One super rugby title 10 years ago. Nothing since
Again, Savea, nothing since the start of his super rugby career. Not the leader, not the main player.
If anything, you’ve proved my point. No international success as leaders. Nothing in the past 3-4 years
Makes you wonder why Robertson kept selecting them, eh?
I completely agree with you. No where have I defended Robertson. I’m glad he’s gone
