All Blacks 2023
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@Dan54 literally all you offer as an argument is an appeal to authority. It's a well known logical fallacy. It's a bit odd for someone who follows rugby as much as you do.
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@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
which trophies did the ABs not win?
Funnily enough the ABs have won or retained all trophies they play for under Foz! Actually up to this satge is most successful AB coach at that since turn of the century!
Except the Qatar Cup.
@pakman said in All Blacks 2023:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
which trophies did the ABs not win?
Funnily enough the ABs have won or retained all trophies they play for under Foz! Actually up to this satge is most successful AB coach at that since turn of the century!
Except the Qatar Cup.
I had thought of that, but didn't bother because noone else ever won it, or will win it again as it a oncer. The only trophies as such are Freedom cup, Bled, Tri Nations (even that doesn't count as a one of) and rugby championship.
Mate it was a lighthearted thing anyway, just saying how looking back in history his record will look alright. -
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
Luatua wasn't wanted for some ungodly reason
I know why they wanted Fifita, incredibly gifted, but they couldn't get the balance right. Akira very similar. PGS should never have been picked.
I am very interested in what the side looks like next year.
Not sure if it occurs straight away, but by the next World Cup, I expect to see Gardiner and Haig dueling for the six jersey, Lakai, Papalii, Ardie, Suafoa, Grace, Withy, Flanders, Lio-Willie, Broughton, Sititi are the others I think will be in that loose forward picture... excuse me if I have forgotten someone.
@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
Luatua wasn't wanted for some ungodly reason
I know why they wanted Fifita, incredibly gifted, but they couldn't get the balance right. Akira very similar. PGS should never have been picked.
I am very interested in what the side looks like next year.
Not sure if it occurs straight away, but by the next World Cup, I expect to see Gardiner and Haig dueling for the six jersey, Lakai, Papalii, Ardie, Suafoa, Grace, Withy, Flanders, Lio-Willie, Broughton, Sititi are the others I think will be in that loose forward picture... excuse me if I have forgotten someone.
Stodart, Delaney, TK Howden, Hicks, Segner ...
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Maybe we should just add all loosies running around in NPC, SR U20 and 1st XV rugby for completeness?
@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2023:
Maybe we should just add all loosies running around in NPC, SR U20 and 1st XV rugby for completeness?
Yeah, I mean as a one-eyed Otago fan, I thought Stodart had an outstanding debut. But that was 70 minutes vs a rotated version of the 10th best team in the competition. Segner perhaps could kick on too, but I've seen nothing out of Delaney, Hicks and Howden that says All Black.
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@pakman said in All Blacks 2023:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
which trophies did the ABs not win?
Funnily enough the ABs have won or retained all trophies they play for under Foz! Actually up to this satge is most successful AB coach at that since turn of the century!
Except the Qatar Cup.
I had thought of that, but didn't bother because noone else ever won it, or will win it again as it a oncer. The only trophies as such are Freedom cup, Bled, Tri Nations (even that doesn't count as a one of) and rugby championship.
Mate it was a lighthearted thing anyway, just saying how looking back in history his record will look alright.@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2023:
@pakman said in All Blacks 2023:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
which trophies did the ABs not win?
Funnily enough the ABs have won or retained all trophies they play for under Foz! Actually up to this satge is most successful AB coach at that since turn of the century!
Except the Qatar Cup.
I had thought of that, but didn't bother because noone else ever won it, or will win it again as it a oncer. The only trophies as such are Freedom cup, Bled, Tri Nations (even that doesn't count as a one of) and rugby championship.
Mate it was a lighthearted thing anyway, just saying how looking back in history his record will look alright.It's the bolded bit that everyone is taking issue with.
Even if we were to win this RWC, history will not forget that we had never lost to Ireland. That we had never lost to Argentina. That we had never lost at home to Ireland. That we had never lost a home series to Ireland.
(c) @reprobate , I couldn't be bothered retyping so just pasted your words :smiling_face_with_sunglasses:
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On the replacement player - fringe loosies have been named to play this weekend (Ioane & Blackadder). Tuipulotu is missing from the Auckland 23 haven't heard anything about him being injured
@Duluth said in All Blacks 2023:
On the replacement player - fringe loosies have been named to play this weekend (Ioane & Blackadder). Tuipulotu is missing from the Auckland 23 haven't heard anything about him being injured
Believe he is serving a one match suspension for doing his post match interview with his mouthguard in.
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@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2023:
@pakman said in All Blacks 2023:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
which trophies did the ABs not win?
Funnily enough the ABs have won or retained all trophies they play for under Foz! Actually up to this satge is most successful AB coach at that since turn of the century!
Except the Qatar Cup.
I had thought of that, but didn't bother because noone else ever won it, or will win it again as it a oncer. The only trophies as such are Freedom cup, Bled, Tri Nations (even that doesn't count as a one of) and rugby championship.
Mate it was a lighthearted thing anyway, just saying how looking back in history his record will look alright.It's the bolded bit that everyone is taking issue with.
Even if we were to win this RWC, history will not forget that we had never lost to Ireland. That we had never lost to Argentina. That we had never lost at home to Ireland. That we had never lost a home series to Ireland.
(c) @reprobate , I couldn't be bothered retyping so just pasted your words :smiling_face_with_sunglasses:
@voodoo said in All Blacks 2023:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2023:
@pakman said in All Blacks 2023:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
which trophies did the ABs not win?
Funnily enough the ABs have won or retained all trophies they play for under Foz! Actually up to this satge is most successful AB coach at that since turn of the century!
Except the Qatar Cup.
I had thought of that, but didn't bother because noone else ever won it, or will win it again as it a oncer. The only trophies as such are Freedom cup, Bled, Tri Nations (even that doesn't count as a one of) and rugby championship.
Mate it was a lighthearted thing anyway, just saying how looking back in history his record will look alright.It's the bolded bit that everyone is taking issue with.
Even if we were to win this RWC, history will not forget that we had never lost to Ireland. That we had never lost to Argentina. That we had never lost at home to Ireland. That we had never lost a home series to Ireland.
(c) @reprobate , I couldn't be bothered retyping so just pasted your words :smiling_face_with_sunglasses:
Funnily enough, history will forget, without looking it up,can you tell me when the first time we didn't beat Argentina, the first time we didn't beat Ireland etc, how long it took to win a series in SA. It's important to some now, but genuinely mainly to people who have only followed ABs since turn of century kind of thing.
Though to be fair, I know some people remember negative things only, and thats how it is. And in all sports, history is there but it's only important for now in sport.
As I said, do you remeber that Crusaders won Super Pac, or that they lost to Fijian Drua? -
@voodoo said in All Blacks 2023:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2023:
@pakman said in All Blacks 2023:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
which trophies did the ABs not win?
Funnily enough the ABs have won or retained all trophies they play for under Foz! Actually up to this satge is most successful AB coach at that since turn of the century!
Except the Qatar Cup.
I had thought of that, but didn't bother because noone else ever won it, or will win it again as it a oncer. The only trophies as such are Freedom cup, Bled, Tri Nations (even that doesn't count as a one of) and rugby championship.
Mate it was a lighthearted thing anyway, just saying how looking back in history his record will look alright.It's the bolded bit that everyone is taking issue with.
Even if we were to win this RWC, history will not forget that we had never lost to Ireland. That we had never lost to Argentina. That we had never lost at home to Ireland. That we had never lost a home series to Ireland.
(c) @reprobate , I couldn't be bothered retyping so just pasted your words :smiling_face_with_sunglasses:
Funnily enough, history will forget, without looking it up,can you tell me when the first time we didn't beat Argentina, the first time we didn't beat Ireland etc, how long it took to win a series in SA. It's important to some now, but genuinely mainly to people who have only followed ABs since turn of century kind of thing.
Though to be fair, I know some people remember negative things only, and thats how it is. And in all sports, history is there but it's only important for now in sport.
As I said, do you remeber that Crusaders won Super Pac, or that they lost to Fijian Drua?@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2023:
@voodoo said in All Blacks 2023:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2023:
@pakman said in All Blacks 2023:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
which trophies did the ABs not win?
Funnily enough the ABs have won or retained all trophies they play for under Foz! Actually up to this satge is most successful AB coach at that since turn of the century!
Except the Qatar Cup.
I had thought of that, but didn't bother because noone else ever won it, or will win it again as it a oncer. The only trophies as such are Freedom cup, Bled, Tri Nations (even that doesn't count as a one of) and rugby championship.
Mate it was a lighthearted thing anyway, just saying how looking back in history his record will look alright.It's the bolded bit that everyone is taking issue with.
Even if we were to win this RWC, history will not forget that we had never lost to Ireland. That we had never lost to Argentina. That we had never lost at home to Ireland. That we had never lost a home series to Ireland.
(c) @reprobate , I couldn't be bothered retyping so just pasted your words :smiling_face_with_sunglasses:
Funnily enough, history will forget, without looking it up,can you tell me when the first time we didn't beat Argentina, the first time we didn't beat Ireland etc, how long it took to win a series in SA. It's important to some now, but genuinely mainly to people who have only followed ABs since turn of century kind of thing.
Though to be fair, I know some people remember negative things only, and thats how it is. And in all sports, history is there but it's only important for now in sport.
As I said, do you remeber that Crusaders won Super Pac, or that they lost to Fijian Drua?Christ you're a painful apologist Dan
It doesn't matter what the date was, it matters that it fucking happened
People still perform plays about us losing to Munster, I don't know what I had for dinner that day either.
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@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2023:
@voodoo said in All Blacks 2023:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2023:
@pakman said in All Blacks 2023:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
which trophies did the ABs not win?
Funnily enough the ABs have won or retained all trophies they play for under Foz! Actually up to this satge is most successful AB coach at that since turn of the century!
Except the Qatar Cup.
I had thought of that, but didn't bother because noone else ever won it, or will win it again as it a oncer. The only trophies as such are Freedom cup, Bled, Tri Nations (even that doesn't count as a one of) and rugby championship.
Mate it was a lighthearted thing anyway, just saying how looking back in history his record will look alright.It's the bolded bit that everyone is taking issue with.
Even if we were to win this RWC, history will not forget that we had never lost to Ireland. That we had never lost to Argentina. That we had never lost at home to Ireland. That we had never lost a home series to Ireland.
(c) @reprobate , I couldn't be bothered retyping so just pasted your words :smiling_face_with_sunglasses:
Funnily enough, history will forget, without looking it up,can you tell me when the first time we didn't beat Argentina, the first time we didn't beat Ireland etc, how long it took to win a series in SA. It's important to some now, but genuinely mainly to people who have only followed ABs since turn of century kind of thing.
Though to be fair, I know some people remember negative things only, and thats how it is. And in all sports, history is there but it's only important for now in sport.
As I said, do you remeber that Crusaders won Super Pac, or that they lost to Fijian Drua?Christ you're a painful apologist Dan
It doesn't matter what the date was, it matters that it fucking happened
People still perform plays about us losing to Munster, I don't know what I had for dinner that day either.
@voodoo said in All Blacks 2023:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2023:
@voodoo said in All Blacks 2023:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2023:
@pakman said in All Blacks 2023:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
which trophies did the ABs not win?
Funnily enough the ABs have won or retained all trophies they play for under Foz! Actually up to this satge is most successful AB coach at that since turn of the century!
Except the Qatar Cup.
I had thought of that, but didn't bother because noone else ever won it, or will win it again as it a oncer. The only trophies as such are Freedom cup, Bled, Tri Nations (even that doesn't count as a one of) and rugby championship.
Mate it was a lighthearted thing anyway, just saying how looking back in history his record will look alright.It's the bolded bit that everyone is taking issue with.
Even if we were to win this RWC, history will not forget that we had never lost to Ireland. That we had never lost to Argentina. That we had never lost at home to Ireland. That we had never lost a home series to Ireland.
(c) @reprobate , I couldn't be bothered retyping so just pasted your words :smiling_face_with_sunglasses:
Funnily enough, history will forget, without looking it up,can you tell me when the first time we didn't beat Argentina, the first time we didn't beat Ireland etc, how long it took to win a series in SA. It's important to some now, but genuinely mainly to people who have only followed ABs since turn of century kind of thing.
Though to be fair, I know some people remember negative things only, and thats how it is. And in all sports, history is there but it's only important for now in sport.
As I said, do you remeber that Crusaders won Super Pac, or that they lost to Fijian Drua?Christ you're a painful apologist Dan
It doesn't matter what the date was, it matters that it fucking happened
People still perform plays about us losing to Munster, I don't know what I had for dinner that day either.
Haha , I didn't realise I was apologising for anyone, just think it's funny.
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@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2023:
@pakman said in All Blacks 2023:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
which trophies did the ABs not win?
Funnily enough the ABs have won or retained all trophies they play for under Foz! Actually up to this satge is most successful AB coach at that since turn of the century!
Except the Qatar Cup.
I had thought of that, but didn't bother because noone else ever won it, or will win it again as it a oncer. The only trophies as such are Freedom cup, Bled, Tri Nations (even that doesn't count as a one of) and rugby championship.
Mate it was a lighthearted thing anyway, just saying how looking back in history his record will look alright.It's the bolded bit that everyone is taking issue with.
Even if we were to win this RWC, history will not forget that we had never lost to Ireland. That we had never lost to Argentina. That we had never lost at home to Ireland. That we had never lost a home series to Ireland.
(c) @reprobate , I couldn't be bothered retyping so just pasted your words :smiling_face_with_sunglasses:
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@booboo said in All Blacks 2023:
@voodoo said in All Blacks 2023:
we had never lost to Ireland
To be fair, that was Hansen.
Jeez, I was hardly going to fact check a fellow ferner was I!
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History and legacies matter.
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And they matter to Argentina and Ireland
It's been an aura-ble era. -
For those that slag off Stuff, at least their assessment of Foster is right
Sure, winning the Cup would paper over a lot of the cracks that have appeared on the All Blacks’ facade (since the last two years of the Steve Hansen tenure, if we’re honest). And losing it would unleash the hounds, so to speak.
this perplexing character who puffs his chest out in defiance when things are unravelling, yet twists himself into a knot at the mere hint of media criticism. He tells us he’s a fighter and survivor; yet he appears to have a thin exterior when the going gets tough. He has repeatedly undertaken his only in-depth media interviews in recent years with hand-picked friendly types happy to sing from the songbook.
Yet he sulks when the narrative twists not his way, and has shunned critics who have challenged his record and ways. Some decisions, too, have been off beam, which he has either refused to acknowledge or sidestepped completely.
Some thing that is often brought up on here, and I endless spout, is that Late Hansen was when the rot started, and keeping Foster was the dumbest decision ever. Let's keep part of a failing regime
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For those that slag off Stuff, at least their assessment of Foster is right
Sure, winning the Cup would paper over a lot of the cracks that have appeared on the All Blacks’ facade (since the last two years of the Steve Hansen tenure, if we’re honest). And losing it would unleash the hounds, so to speak.
this perplexing character who puffs his chest out in defiance when things are unravelling, yet twists himself into a knot at the mere hint of media criticism. He tells us he’s a fighter and survivor; yet he appears to have a thin exterior when the going gets tough. He has repeatedly undertaken his only in-depth media interviews in recent years with hand-picked friendly types happy to sing from the songbook.
Yet he sulks when the narrative twists not his way, and has shunned critics who have challenged his record and ways. Some decisions, too, have been off beam, which he has either refused to acknowledge or sidestepped completely.
Some thing that is often brought up on here, and I endless spout, is that Late Hansen was when the rot started, and keeping Foster was the dumbest decision ever. Let's keep part of a failing regime
@Machpants said in All Blacks 2023:
For those that slag off Stuff, at least their assessment of Foster is right
Sure, winning the Cup would paper over a lot of the cracks that have appeared on the All Blacks’ facade (since the last two years of the Steve Hansen tenure, if we’re honest). And losing it would unleash the hounds, so to speak.
this perplexing character who puffs his chest out in defiance when things are unravelling, yet twists himself into a knot at the mere hint of media criticism. He tells us he’s a fighter and survivor; yet he appears to have a thin exterior when the going gets tough. He has repeatedly undertaken his only in-depth media interviews in recent years with hand-picked friendly types happy to sing from the songbook.
Yet he sulks when the narrative twists not his way, and has shunned critics who have challenged his record and ways. Some decisions, too, have been off beam, which he has either refused to acknowledge or sidestepped completely.
Some thing that is often brought up on here, and I endless spout, is that Late Hansen was when the rot started, and keeping Foster was the dumbest decision ever. Let's keep part of a failing regime
Lazy administration. That's the thing about continuity, it only makes sense if you are trying to carry on a winning culture
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Is there such a thing as an anonymous expert who is not directly involved with the coaching group who gives detailed feedback on what is obvious to all outside the group. That is the failure to exit, contestable bombs etc?
Seems the AB's might be suffering a little bit of group think because we have been banging this drum for years. -
How did the All Blacks go from being so good and so widely respected in 2015 to being a bit of a laughing stock at the moment?
Bad tactics by Foster.
A culture of complacency within the All Blacks.
Failure to adapt to changing tactics by other international sides.
Not monitoring developments in the international game closely enough.
A failure for individual players to go away and work on obvious weaknesses in their game.
Devaluing possession and the kicking game.
A generation of players that is much less gifted than those that emerged in the 2000s.
Low crowds for domestic NZ Rugby.
Fewer people playing club rugby in NZ.
A board who were content to wallow in past glories rather than plan for the future.Anything I’ve missed?
