The Silver Fern

@Jet Sevu Reece staying put in the ABs over a Fineanganofo or Tangitau or Nanai-Seturo is just stupid in my opinion because Reece will surely not be in the team by the world cup so why not just get rid now?

Tonight was for Garden Bachop so proud of the believe in this team

Is it time to bring Nick Evans back home

@george33 said in Final: Canterbury v Otago:

Pledger and Casey definitely not close test rugby maybe not even Super,

I'll bite, wtf are you on about George those 2 lads will have the zoo pumping during super, the fact of the matter is they were huge reasons why Otago made it to the big dance for the 1st time in 20 years, Canterbury were just better today came out firing in the 2nd half, knocking two young lads in their 1st full class season is just stupid

@frugby No u will see It time to cum back home for Caleb, JRK 2. Vern will B see them as replace of Mark. Just wait & C. Let story play out, trust contact Sauce good.

@SBW1 paywalled but see enough to see it's about Frizell, move on ffs. Invest in Parker, Finau or Howden

@frugby said in All Blacks 2025:

Given Razor's first test was against England, you can make some reasonable comparisons. The 23s:
England in Dunedin 2024/England in London 2025

1. Ethan de Groot

2. Codie Taylor

3. Tyrel Lomax/Fletcher Newell

4. Scott Barrett

5. Patrick Tuipulotu/Josh Lord

6. Samipeni Finau/Simon Parker

7. Dalton Papalii/Ardie Savea

8. Ardie Savea/Peter Lakai

9. TJ Perenara/Cam Roigard

10. Damian McKenzie/Beauden Barrett

11. Mark Telea/Leicester Fainga'anuku

12. Jordie Barrett/Quinn Tupaea

13. Rieko Ioane/Billy Proctor

14. Sevu Reece/Leroy Carter

15. Stephen Perofeta/Will Jordan

16. Asafo Aumua/Samisoni Taukei'aho

17. Ofa Tu'ungafasi/Tamaiti Williams

18. Fletcher Newell/Pasilio Tosi

19. Tupou Vaa'i/Sam Darry

20. Luke Jacobson/Wallace Sititi

21. Finlay Christie/Cortez Ratima

22. Anton Lienert-Brown

23. Beauden Barrett/Damian McKenzie

Obviously injuries play a part, but I honestly think if anything sums up that things are going wrong, it is that 18 months down the line from Razor's first test, he still has Anton Lienert-Brown filling the 22 jersey.

Outside of that, despite the criticism, they have actually managed to blood a lot of players, even if it has been due to injuries, the issue is, a lot of them don't seem to be very good. The debutants in the Razor era:

Cortez Ratima - Could/should feasibly end up fifth in the pecking order by the next international window
Billy Proctor - Incredibly underwhelming given the hype
Noah Hotham - Jury massively still out
George Bell - Hardly used since
Wallace Sititi - Star burned early, but has not been great this year
Pasilio Tosi - Think he has been a success
Sam Darry - Rated as our sixth best lock
Harry Plummer - Gone
Peter Lakai - After a near flawless debut, hardly sighted until the EOYT this year
Ruben Love - LOL
Fabian Holland - Stevie Wonder could see his talent
Christian Lio-Willie - Solid v France then done away with
Du'Plessis Kirifi - Unlikely to be an All Black next year
Ollie Norris - Looks a prospect
Timoci Tavatavanawai - Given injury, tough to say how his season may have ended up, but the mafia chose ALB on the bench ahead of him in Argentina so...
Brodie McAllister - Barring an injury crisis won't play again for the All Blacks
Simon Parker - Has underwhelmed
Leroy Carter - Good solid start, but his long-term prospects don't appear strong

Overwhelmingly, this seems to be a case of quality, not quantity. There are several things here. Is this poor talent ID? Is this poor coaching? Is this poor gameplan?

Probably a combination? I could be wrong, but I don't imagine there is actually a heck of a lot of technical coaching occuring at the international level - I imagine that happens at club level before you actually reach the top level. The ABs not being able to pass under pressure is not the fault of the coaches from a coaching perspective, but more a selection perspective.
The question is whether the guys not selected are much better? Given we have cycled through so many players, the chance of say Ruben Love or Hoskins Sotutu coming in and shining in this environment feels extraordinarily slim, and I don't know enough to explain why. Is it a case of Super Rugby not preparing guys for test rugby or is this squarely on the coaches? As @Bones says, Proctor particularly just looked like an obvious upgrade to the regular punter.

I have no doubt the All Blacks will eventually get back to the top of the pile, because these things are cyclical, but I suspect there will be some really interesting takes of what is happening in NZR right now from many different people in ten years time, and given difference of opinion, we may never truly get an answer.

Love would've been better off playing 7 or 8 rounds of npc as Wellingtons 10 than his 20 minutes on the wing during the Rugby championship

@Bones 5 Tests and zero Sotutu wtf

@Bones Luke Romano has that 2011 Brad thorn mana about him!

I'm so Proud of the boys!!! Rieko's best test in the midfield

@frugby have heard a rumour Blackadder has an offer on the table to join his old man at Toshiba this time next yr, so there's a possibility Ethan may have already played his final test

Fihaki such a clumsy player

Thank goodness for Leka Halasima

Grace is kinda average lately

@BerniesCorner said in England Vs All Blacks:

If you think about some of the props, locks and loosies we haven't had over the past 5 years, at the moment everyday is a good day.

Foster had his shortcomings but he was brave to bring Vaa'i and Lord into the environment as 20 yr olds, those selections bearing fruit for the nation nowadays

@Mackerzzzz Luke Jacobson quickly becoming the forgotten man of NZ rugby

@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks vs Ireland - series decider:

Goodhue 12 Reiko 13, gonna be the world cup combo, Clarke 11 Jordan 14. ALB, Reece, TUJ to fight for 23 jersey.

poor Rieko, the amount of times I've seen his name misspell through the years would be in the hundreds

@george33 you were right George, it is bizarre tho as Fihaki wouldn't even start at the Landers these days

Tavatavanawai unbelievable leader for this team

Luke Jacobson for mine is the forward version of Anton lienert-Brown, would love to have them in my super rugby side but at All Black level I'm less enthusiastic about them