All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II
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@reprobate said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@brodean said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@tubbyj said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
Not so sure. Ioane was all class in defense and hustle on the Aussies when the All Blacks were turning the screws and mounting the pressure on them keeping them pinned in their own half.. Tupaea while great on attack allowed them easy metres out wide and at times in the first half hour it looked like they could rip us a new one like the Sprinkboks did. Defense and pressuring other teams into mistakes to turn over possession is just such a critical part of test rugby now and Reiko is the best exponent of this at centre in NZ. It is something we have been shit at all season until the final 20 of this game.
I personally would like to see Tupaea at 12 and Ioane at 13 and Jordie Barrett the only one who looks assured under the high ball at 15. Jordan to the wing and massive practise on catching high balls. I just can't see us ever beating the boks consistently with him at the back catching less than 50% of high balls.
- Roigard
- Anyone other than Beauden or Damien
- Leroy Carter/Caleb Clarke
- Quinn Tuaaea
- Reiko Ioane
- Will Jordan
- Jordie Barrett
reserve Hotham/Ratima
reserve. Mackenzie
reserve. Leicester FaingaสปanukuAgree with this.
Jordan just isnt nailing it as a test fullback. He takes so many poor options hes better suited to right wing where he has less tactical influence - especially with our 10 options also taking poor options.
100% and have been saying that for a while. Jordan is a great winger but not a great fullback.
Who is better at 15, and which winger would you drop?
At the risk of triggering you. BB is a better 15.
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@reprobate said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@brodean said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@tubbyj said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
Not so sure. Ioane was all class in defense and hustle on the Aussies when the All Blacks were turning the screws and mounting the pressure on them keeping them pinned in their own half.. Tupaea while great on attack allowed them easy metres out wide and at times in the first half hour it looked like they could rip us a new one like the Sprinkboks did. Defense and pressuring other teams into mistakes to turn over possession is just such a critical part of test rugby now and Reiko is the best exponent of this at centre in NZ. It is something we have been shit at all season until the final 20 of this game.
I personally would like to see Tupaea at 12 and Ioane at 13 and Jordie Barrett the only one who looks assured under the high ball at 15. Jordan to the wing and massive practise on catching high balls. I just can't see us ever beating the boks consistently with him at the back catching less than 50% of high balls.
- Roigard
- Anyone other than Beauden or Damien
- Leroy Carter/Caleb Clarke
- Quinn Tuaaea
- Reiko Ioane
- Will Jordan
- Jordie Barrett
reserve Hotham/Ratima
reserve. Mackenzie
reserve. Leicester FaingaสปanukuAgree with this.
Jordan just isnt nailing it as a test fullback. He takes so many poor options hes better suited to right wing where he has less tactical influence - especially with our 10 options also taking poor options.
100% and have been saying that for a while. Jordan is a great winger but not a great fullback.
Who is better at 15, and which winger would you drop?
At the risk of triggering you. BB is a better 15.
I've probably said this before, but if moving BB to 15 was the price for getting him out of 10, I'd take that: he can't screw the entire backline from fullback.
He also genuinely used to be a world class fullback (shit he may even still be) - he's never been a world class 10, and his play there has deteriorated badly. TBH I think his best play historically may well have been coming off the bench, and another calm experienced guy coming on late should have been the ideal use for him I would have thought - though I don't really think that now, because he hasn't been going well under pressure lately.So if Jordan goes to a wing and BB to fullback... Is it Clarke/Fainganuku or Carter getting dropped? None of them deserve it on performance I'd reckon?
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@Rancid-Schnitzel said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@reprobate said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@brodean said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@tubbyj said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
Not so sure. Ioane was all class in defense and hustle on the Aussies when the All Blacks were turning the screws and mounting the pressure on them keeping them pinned in their own half.. Tupaea while great on attack allowed them easy metres out wide and at times in the first half hour it looked like they could rip us a new one like the Sprinkboks did. Defense and pressuring other teams into mistakes to turn over possession is just such a critical part of test rugby now and Reiko is the best exponent of this at centre in NZ. It is something we have been shit at all season until the final 20 of this game.
I personally would like to see Tupaea at 12 and Ioane at 13 and Jordie Barrett the only one who looks assured under the high ball at 15. Jordan to the wing and massive practise on catching high balls. I just can't see us ever beating the boks consistently with him at the back catching less than 50% of high balls.
- Roigard
- Anyone other than Beauden or Damien
- Leroy Carter/Caleb Clarke
- Quinn Tuaaea
- Reiko Ioane
- Will Jordan
- Jordie Barrett
reserve Hotham/Ratima
reserve. Mackenzie
reserve. Leicester FaingaสปanukuAgree with this.
Jordan just isnt nailing it as a test fullback. He takes so many poor options hes better suited to right wing where he has less tactical influence - especially with our 10 options also taking poor options.
100% and have been saying that for a while. Jordan is a great winger but not a great fullback.
Who is better at 15, and which winger would you drop?
At the risk of triggering you. BB is a better 15.
I've probably said this before, but if moving BB to 15 was the price for getting him out of 10, I'd take that: he can't screw the entire backline from fullback.
He also genuinely used to be a world class fullback (shit he may even still be) - he's never been a world class 10, and his play there has deteriorated badly. TBH I think his best play historically may well have been coming off the bench, and another calm experienced guy coming on late should have been the ideal use for him I would have thought - though I don't really think that now, because he hasn't been going well under pressure lately.So if Jordan goes to a wing and BB to fullback... Is it Clarke/Fainganuku or Carter getting dropped? None of them deserve it on performance I'd reckon?
@reprobate said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@reprobate said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@brodean said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@tubbyj said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
Not so sure. Ioane was all class in defense and hustle on the Aussies when the All Blacks were turning the screws and mounting the pressure on them keeping them pinned in their own half.. Tupaea while great on attack allowed them easy metres out wide and at times in the first half hour it looked like they could rip us a new one like the Sprinkboks did. Defense and pressuring other teams into mistakes to turn over possession is just such a critical part of test rugby now and Reiko is the best exponent of this at centre in NZ. It is something we have been shit at all season until the final 20 of this game.
I personally would like to see Tupaea at 12 and Ioane at 13 and Jordie Barrett the only one who looks assured under the high ball at 15. Jordan to the wing and massive practise on catching high balls. I just can't see us ever beating the boks consistently with him at the back catching less than 50% of high balls.
- Roigard
- Anyone other than Beauden or Damien
- Leroy Carter/Caleb Clarke
- Quinn Tuaaea
- Reiko Ioane
- Will Jordan
- Jordie Barrett
reserve Hotham/Ratima
reserve. Mackenzie
reserve. Leicester FaingaสปanukuAgree with this.
Jordan just isnt nailing it as a test fullback. He takes so many poor options hes better suited to right wing where he has less tactical influence - especially with our 10 options also taking poor options.
100% and have been saying that for a while. Jordan is a great winger but not a great fullback.
Who is better at 15, and which winger would you drop?
At the risk of triggering you. BB is a better 15.
I've probably said this before, but if moving BB to 15 was the price for getting him out of 10, I'd take that: he can't screw the entire backline from fullback.
He also genuinely used to be a world class fullback (shit he may even still be) - he's never been a world class 10, and his play there has deteriorated badly. TBH I think his best play historically may well have been coming off the bench, and another calm experienced guy coming on late should have been the ideal use for him I would have thought - though I don't really think that now, because he hasn't been going well under pressure lately.So if Jordan goes to a wing and BB to fullback... Is it Clarke/Fainganuku or Carter getting dropped? None of them deserve it on performance I'd reckon?
Given the fact that no Barrett can ever be dropped........yes.
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@reprobate said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@reprobate said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@Rancid-Schnitzel said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@brodean said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@tubbyj said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
Not so sure. Ioane was all class in defense and hustle on the Aussies when the All Blacks were turning the screws and mounting the pressure on them keeping them pinned in their own half.. Tupaea while great on attack allowed them easy metres out wide and at times in the first half hour it looked like they could rip us a new one like the Sprinkboks did. Defense and pressuring other teams into mistakes to turn over possession is just such a critical part of test rugby now and Reiko is the best exponent of this at centre in NZ. It is something we have been shit at all season until the final 20 of this game.
I personally would like to see Tupaea at 12 and Ioane at 13 and Jordie Barrett the only one who looks assured under the high ball at 15. Jordan to the wing and massive practise on catching high balls. I just can't see us ever beating the boks consistently with him at the back catching less than 50% of high balls.
- Roigard
- Anyone other than Beauden or Damien
- Leroy Carter/Caleb Clarke
- Quinn Tuaaea
- Reiko Ioane
- Will Jordan
- Jordie Barrett
reserve Hotham/Ratima
reserve. Mackenzie
reserve. Leicester FaingaสปanukuAgree with this.
Jordan just isnt nailing it as a test fullback. He takes so many poor options hes better suited to right wing where he has less tactical influence - especially with our 10 options also taking poor options.
100% and have been saying that for a while. Jordan is a great winger but not a great fullback.
Who is better at 15, and which winger would you drop?
At the risk of triggering you. BB is a better 15.
I've probably said this before, but if moving BB to 15 was the price for getting him out of 10, I'd take that: he can't screw the entire backline from fullback.
He also genuinely used to be a world class fullback (shit he may even still be) - he's never been a world class 10, and his play there has deteriorated badly. TBH I think his best play historically may well have been coming off the bench, and another calm experienced guy coming on late should have been the ideal use for him I would have thought - though I don't really think that now, because he hasn't been going well under pressure lately.So if Jordan goes to a wing and BB to fullback... Is it Clarke/Fainganuku or Carter getting dropped? None of them deserve it on performance I'd reckon?
Given the fact that no Barrett can ever be dropped........yes.
@MN5 said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
Given the fact that no Barrett can ever be dropped........yes.
Once Richie comes back, watch out Beauden!
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@MN5 said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
Given the fact that no Barrett can ever be dropped........yes.
Once Richie comes back, watch out Beauden!
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@MN5 said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
Given the fact that no Barrett can ever be dropped........yes.
Once Richie comes back, watch out Beauden!
Or more accurately, watch out DMac
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@MN5 said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
Given the fact that no Barrett can ever be dropped........yes.
Once Richie comes back, watch out Beauden!
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@MN5 said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
Given the fact that no Barrett can ever be dropped........yes.
Once Richie comes back, watch out Beauden!
Only for the games with big crowds though eh, Richie wouldn't lower himself to play unless there are sufficient numbers witnessing his magnificence.
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@nostrildamus said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@MN5 said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
Given the fact that no Barrett can ever be dropped........yes.
Once Richie comes back, watch out Beauden!
Only for the games with big crowds though eh, Richie wouldn't lower himself to play unless there are sufficient numbers witnessing his magnificence.
@reprobate said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@MN5 said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
Given the fact that no Barrett can ever be dropped........yes.
Once Richie comes back, watch out Beauden!
Only for the games with big crowds though eh, Richie wouldn't lower himself to play unless there are sufficient numbers witnessing his magnificence.
If that's a real quote, fucken hell
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Itโs crap from Knowler.
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
Itโs crap from Knowler.
Yeah 100% Mounga happy to come back and play for Canterbury he knew that when the deal was made to come back.It was all mapped out.
Just another shit piece of journalism. -
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
Itโs crap from Knowler.
Yeah 100% Mounga happy to come back and play for Canterbury he knew that when the deal was made to come back.It was all mapped out.
Just another shit piece of journalism.@Chris said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
Itโs crap from Knowler.
Yeah 100% Mounga happy to come back and play for Canterbury he knew that when the deal was made to come back.It was all mapped out.
Just another shit piece of journalism.Phew
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Classic 1 + 1 =3 stuff
Richie plays in Japan = big crowds
NPC rugby in NZ = sometimes near empty stadiumsJoin the two mutually exclusive facts together = Richie doesnโt want to play on front of empty stadiums.
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Itโs crap from Knowler.
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
Itโs crap from Knowler.
Yeah I read that and thought it was a worse than sly attempt at character assassination. Might be true or false for all I know but felt like there was an agenda there.
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Reading through this thread now. Just a comment about Sititi and Lakai, and what is their best positions. When they played together in the 2022 NZ U20s Lakai was the no.8 and Sititi at 7 (Haig was the 6). Sititi's body shape has changed since then, so less suited to being an openside now. It would be good to have a 7 like McReight who constantly puts pressure on the opposition breakdown. Kirifi has found out that being able to do that at test level is much harder than in SR. Papalii isn't that great either, and more a cleaner on our ball than a disruptor.
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Reading through this thread now. Just a comment about Sititi and Lakai, and what is their best positions. When they played together in the 2022 NZ U20s Lakai was the no.8 and Sititi at 7 (Haig was the 6). Sititi's body shape has changed since then, so less suited to being an openside now. It would be good to have a 7 like McReight who constantly puts pressure on the opposition breakdown. Kirifi has found out that being able to do that at test level is much harder than in SR. Papalii isn't that great either, and more a cleaner on our ball than a disruptor.
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@Chris-B said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@Bovidae Tavatavanawai into 7?
@Chris-B said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@Bovidae Tavatavanawai into 7?
Well are there really any technical skills Ardie uses which Jim doesn't have? He's a stronger runner, a harder tackler, and as good on the turnover. No idea how he goes hitting rucks, but if that isn't part of the job description then I'd say all of the strengths you could argue he's better at...
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Reading through this thread now. Just a comment about Sititi and Lakai, and what is their best positions. When they played together in the 2022 NZ U20s Lakai was the no.8 and Sititi at 7 (Haig was the 6). Sititi's body shape has changed since then, so less suited to being an openside now. It would be good to have a 7 like McReight who constantly puts pressure on the opposition breakdown. Kirifi has found out that being able to do that at test level is much harder than in SR. Papalii isn't that great either, and more a cleaner on our ball than a disruptor.
@Bovidae said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
Reading through this thread now. Just a comment about Sititi and Lakai, and what is their best positions. When they played together in the 2022 NZ U20s Lakai was the no.8 and Sititi at 7 (Haig was the 6). Sititi's body shape has changed since then, so less suited to being an openside now. It would be good to have a 7 like McReight who constantly puts pressure on the opposition breakdown. Kirifi has found out that being able to do that at test level is much harder than in SR. Papalii isn't that great either, and more a cleaner on our ball than a disruptor.
Maintaining possession is more important than being disruptors. To be a prominent disruptor your team needs to be defending.
Ultimately there wasn't a high value in McReight putting pressure on the ball because they lost comfortably and they also lost more turnovers. Same with Savea and Kirifi for their respective teams in Super Rugby. They feature high as disruptors in SRP but their teams didn't make it to even the semi's.
The Highlanders have 3 disruptors in the top 10 for SRP and see how much good it did them.
Contrast the Crusaders who won - there wasn't a single Crusaders player in the top 10 disruptors this year.
Likewise for the RWC the Springboks do not rank high in this facet.
https://theanalyst.com/club-rugby-stats
https://dataviz.theanalyst.com/rugby-world-cup--interactive-hub/ -
@Bovidae said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
Reading through this thread now. Just a comment about Sititi and Lakai, and what is their best positions. When they played together in the 2022 NZ U20s Lakai was the no.8 and Sititi at 7 (Haig was the 6). Sititi's body shape has changed since then, so less suited to being an openside now. It would be good to have a 7 like McReight who constantly puts pressure on the opposition breakdown. Kirifi has found out that being able to do that at test level is much harder than in SR. Papalii isn't that great either, and more a cleaner on our ball than a disruptor.
Maintaining possession is more important than being disruptors. To be a prominent disruptor your team needs to be defending.
Ultimately there wasn't a high value in McReight putting pressure on the ball because they lost comfortably and they also lost more turnovers. Same with Savea and Kirifi for their respective teams in Super Rugby. They feature high as disruptors in SRP but their teams didn't make it to even the semi's.
The Highlanders have 3 disruptors in the top 10 for SRP and see how much good it did them.
Contrast the Crusaders who won - there wasn't a single Crusaders player in the top 10 disruptors this year.
Likewise for the RWC the Springboks do not rank high in this facet.
https://theanalyst.com/club-rugby-stats
https://dataviz.theanalyst.com/rugby-world-cup--interactive-hub/@brodean said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
https://theanalyst.com/club-rugby-stats
https://dataviz.theanalyst.com/rugby-world-cup--interactive-hub/As an aside, Cam Roigard looked good in those stats on a per minute basis!
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@Bovidae said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
Reading through this thread now. Just a comment about Sititi and Lakai, and what is their best positions. When they played together in the 2022 NZ U20s Lakai was the no.8 and Sititi at 7 (Haig was the 6). Sititi's body shape has changed since then, so less suited to being an openside now. It would be good to have a 7 like McReight who constantly puts pressure on the opposition breakdown. Kirifi has found out that being able to do that at test level is much harder than in SR. Papalii isn't that great either, and more a cleaner on our ball than a disruptor.
Maintaining possession is more important than being disruptors. To be a prominent disruptor your team needs to be defending.
Ultimately there wasn't a high value in McReight putting pressure on the ball because they lost comfortably and they also lost more turnovers. Same with Savea and Kirifi for their respective teams in Super Rugby. They feature high as disruptors in SRP but their teams didn't make it to even the semi's.
The Highlanders have 3 disruptors in the top 10 for SRP and see how much good it did them.
Contrast the Crusaders who won - there wasn't a single Crusaders player in the top 10 disruptors this year.
Likewise for the RWC the Springboks do not rank high in this facet.
https://theanalyst.com/club-rugby-stats
https://dataviz.theanalyst.com/rugby-world-cup--interactive-hub/@brodean said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
Contrast the Crusaders who won - there wasn't a single Crusaders player in the top 10 disruptors this year.
We did have two guys in Christie and CLW that played dual disruptor roles.
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@brodean said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
Contrast the Crusaders who won - there wasn't a single Crusaders player in the top 10 disruptors this year.
We did have two guys in Christie and CLW that played dual disruptor roles.
@ACT-Crusader said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
@brodean said in All Blacks vs Wallabies Bledisloe II:
Contrast the Crusaders who won - there wasn't a single Crusaders player in the top 10 disruptors this year.
We did have two guys in Christie and CLW that played dual disruptor roles.
Statistically they didn't have the same impact compared to others.
