New All Black Coach
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@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
@Bones said in New All Black Coach:
@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
@Nepia said in New All Black Coach:
@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
@Nepia said in New All Black Coach:
@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
I'll expand, which likely won't give greater clarity.
Absolute no-nos:
SA, England, AustraliaIreland probably now goes to that group above, but when he went to Australia, I think they would have been in the group below for me. Argentina are still in the group below, but based on recent results maybe might be going up
I still don't like it:
France, Ireland, ArgentinaGo for it:
Scotland, Wales, Japan, FijiMy criteria is - do they have the quality to win the WC, Bled, or Rugby Championship? If so, no.
It just opens up more holes, the current Oz team has little to no chance of winning the Bledisloe and that's a two horse race, and I'd give Argentina more chance of winning the RC.
The simple fact is, if Rennie wasn't treated so despicably by NZR, he likely wouldn't have taken up the Oz offer at the time he did. You should be forever grateful he turned your franchise from also rans to contenders.
Who have you decided to switch to now?
For as much as I care about franchise rugby I still support the Chiefs, I was just emphasising it was your franchise he brought success to ....
That's the source. He's a fucking great coach, supposedly an excellent person, and I would have selected him as our HC or as an assistant, right up until he went to coach Australia.
After that, fuck him.
Surely you take into account proximity? Plus I would put Aus close to Scotland in your dream world - if we lose to them it says more about us. AB rugby is stronger when Aus rugby is stronger.
#don’tjudgemyirrationality
Yeah I'm probably not going to get on my high horse about irrational dislike.
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@Bones said in New All Black Coach:
@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
@Bones said in New All Black Coach:
@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
@Nepia said in New All Black Coach:
@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
@Nepia said in New All Black Coach:
@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
I'll expand, which likely won't give greater clarity.
Absolute no-nos:
SA, England, AustraliaIreland probably now goes to that group above, but when he went to Australia, I think they would have been in the group below for me. Argentina are still in the group below, but based on recent results maybe might be going up
I still don't like it:
France, Ireland, ArgentinaGo for it:
Scotland, Wales, Japan, FijiMy criteria is - do they have the quality to win the WC, Bled, or Rugby Championship? If so, no.
It just opens up more holes, the current Oz team has little to no chance of winning the Bledisloe and that's a two horse race, and I'd give Argentina more chance of winning the RC.
The simple fact is, if Rennie wasn't treated so despicably by NZR, he likely wouldn't have taken up the Oz offer at the time he did. You should be forever grateful he turned your franchise from also rans to contenders.
Who have you decided to switch to now?
For as much as I care about franchise rugby I still support the Chiefs, I was just emphasising it was your franchise he brought success to ....
That's the source. He's a fucking great coach, supposedly an excellent person, and I would have selected him as our HC or as an assistant, right up until he went to coach Australia.
After that, fuck him.
Surely you take into account proximity? Plus I would put Aus close to Scotland in your dream world - if we lose to them it says more about us. AB rugby is stronger when Aus rugby is stronger.
#don’tjudgemyirrationality
Yeah I'm probably not going to get on my high horse about irrational dislike.
You can borrow mine.
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@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
@Bones said in New All Black Coach:
@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
@Bones said in New All Black Coach:
@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
@Nepia said in New All Black Coach:
@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
@Nepia said in New All Black Coach:
@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
I'll expand, which likely won't give greater clarity.
Absolute no-nos:
SA, England, AustraliaIreland probably now goes to that group above, but when he went to Australia, I think they would have been in the group below for me. Argentina are still in the group below, but based on recent results maybe might be going up
I still don't like it:
France, Ireland, ArgentinaGo for it:
Scotland, Wales, Japan, FijiMy criteria is - do they have the quality to win the WC, Bled, or Rugby Championship? If so, no.
It just opens up more holes, the current Oz team has little to no chance of winning the Bledisloe and that's a two horse race, and I'd give Argentina more chance of winning the RC.
The simple fact is, if Rennie wasn't treated so despicably by NZR, he likely wouldn't have taken up the Oz offer at the time he did. You should be forever grateful he turned your franchise from also rans to contenders.
Who have you decided to switch to now?
For as much as I care about franchise rugby I still support the Chiefs, I was just emphasising it was your franchise he brought success to ....
That's the source. He's a fucking great coach, supposedly an excellent person, and I would have selected him as our HC or as an assistant, right up until he went to coach Australia.
After that, fuck him.
Surely you take into account proximity? Plus I would put Aus close to Scotland in your dream world - if we lose to them it says more about us. AB rugby is stronger when Aus rugby is stronger.
#don’tjudgemyirrationality
Yeah I'm probably not going to get on my high horse about irrational dislike.
You can borrow mine.
Not when mine is finally maturing.
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It's sounding very difficult to become a great AB coach.
Coach an important team that doesn't challenge the ABs.
Make them better but not better than the ABs
Choose your team before the interview
Ace the interview
Improve the ABs so your past experience isn't held against you.
Given even Scotland can currently compete with the ABs, this sounds like an increasingly difficult test... -
@nostrildamus said in New All Black Coach:
It's sounding very difficult to become a great AB coach.
Coach an important team that doesn't challenge the ABs.
Make them better but not better than the ABs
Choose your team before the interview
Ace the interview
Improve the ABs so your past experience isn't held against you.
Given even Scotland can currently compete with the ABs, this sounds like an increasingly difficult test...I think we are down to Wales, you have to coach Wales. That is the only acceptable pathway.
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@reprobate said in New All Black Coach:
@nostrildamus said in New All Black Coach:
It's sounding very difficult to become a great AB coach.
Coach an important team that doesn't challenge the ABs.
Make them better but not better than the ABs
Choose your team before the interview
Ace the interview
Improve the ABs so your past experience isn't held against you.
Given even Scotland can currently compete with the ABs, this sounds like an increasingly difficult test...I think we are down to Wales, you have to coach Wales. That is the only acceptable pathway.
You're welcome
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@MiketheSnow said in New All Black Coach:
@reprobate said in New All Black Coach:
@nostrildamus said in New All Black Coach:
It's sounding very difficult to become a great AB coach.
Coach an important team that doesn't challenge the ABs.
Make them better but not better than the ABs
Choose your team before the interview
Ace the interview
Improve the ABs so your past experience isn't held against you.
Given even Scotland can currently compete with the ABs, this sounds like an increasingly difficult test...I think we are down to Wales, you have to coach Wales. That is the only acceptable pathway.
You're welcome
It's our "Special relationship"
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@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
Funnily enough, not a name that gets mentioned, because fuck Robbie Deans.
I don't mean that in he's a bad person way, just he clearly didn't bleed for the ABs to win.
I honestly can't imagine coaching another team against the ABs. I can't imagine preparing a team to try to beat the ABs and actually thinking / wanting them to win.
I'm prepared to except certain teams based on my personal preference, so I get why it's an irrational belief. Scotland is OK, because if we lose to them it says more about us than them.
Nevertheless, for me, if you have been the head coach of SA (which will never happen for a kiwi), Australia (far too fucking common), or England (and recently Ireland), fuck you very much.
Mate, Ted and Shag both coached overseas teams, if they didn't play Bs while they were there was only luck. I rather coaches learnt to coach test rugby ,even in Aus, than getting thrown in cold for ABs.
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I don't give a shite which other nation a bloke has coached if he is qualified and best candidate he gets the gig.
Dave Rennie hell yeah - I see him as a guy to build the legacy back
Vern Cotter potentially as his forwards coach
Joe Schmitt in a Wayne Smith type role ( or as Razor sees himself without taking the head coach cap).
JJ could also take one of those roles... the biggest thing is they jell and work together which seems to be lacking in the current set up -
@kidcalder said in New All Black Coach:
I don't give a shite which other nation a bloke has coached if he is qualified and best candidate he gets the gig.
Dave Rennie hell yeah - I see him as a guy to build the legacy back
Vern Cotter potentially as his forwards coach
Joe Schmitt in a Wayne Smith type role ( or as Razor sees himself without taking the head coach cap).
JJ could also take one of those roles... the biggest thing is they jell and work together which seems to be lacking in the current set upWe are in a hole right now, this is a dark period in our ABs history, whatever it takes to rebuild our tarnished legacy
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@Bones said in New All Black Coach:
@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
@Bones said in New All Black Coach:
@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
@Nepia said in New All Black Coach:
@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
@Nepia said in New All Black Coach:
@gt12 said in New All Black Coach:
I'll expand, which likely won't give greater clarity.
Absolute no-nos:
SA, England, AustraliaIreland probably now goes to that group above, but when he went to Australia, I think they would have been in the group below for me. Argentina are still in the group below, but based on recent results maybe might be going up
I still don't like it:
France, Ireland, ArgentinaGo for it:
Scotland, Wales, Japan, FijiMy criteria is - do they have the quality to win the WC, Bled, or Rugby Championship? If so, no.
It just opens up more holes, the current Oz team has little to no chance of winning the Bledisloe and that's a two horse race, and I'd give Argentina more chance of winning the RC.
The simple fact is, if Rennie wasn't treated so despicably by NZR, he likely wouldn't have taken up the Oz offer at the time he did. You should be forever grateful he turned your franchise from also rans to contenders.
Who have you decided to switch to now?
For as much as I care about franchise rugby I still support the Chiefs, I was just emphasising it was your franchise he brought success to ....
That's the source. He's a fucking great coach, supposedly an excellent person, and I would have selected him as our HC or as an assistant, right up until he went to coach Australia.
After that, fuck him.
Surely you take into account proximity? Plus I would put Aus close to Scotland in your dream world - if we lose to them it says more about us. AB rugby is stronger when Aus rugby is stronger.
#don’tjudgemyirrationality
Yeah I'm probably not going to get on my high horse about irrational dislike.
Why break with tradition?!
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@Mr-Fish said in New All Black Coach:
Worth pointing out that most Australian supporters are as frustrated with Joe Schmidt's selections over the past six months as NZ fans are with Razor's selections.
Only two players have started in the 10 jersey under Razor's regime, whereas no player has gotten more than three starts in a row in the 10 jersey for the Wallabies this year (with Lolesio, Lynagh, O'Connor, Edmed and Gordon all getting runs, and Donaldson and Stewart covering off the bench). Injuries have played their part but still a bit of a shit show.
Its mostly injury driven.
Williams and Gordon are the ones that are a bit strange to me but with the injuries the cupboard is pretty bare.
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@canefan said in New All Black Coach:
@kidcalder said in New All Black Coach:
I don't give a shite which other nation a bloke has coached if he is qualified and best candidate he gets the gig.
Dave Rennie hell yeah - I see him as a guy to build the legacy back
Vern Cotter potentially as his forwards coach
Joe Schmitt in a Wayne Smith type role ( or as Razor sees himself without taking the head coach cap).
JJ could also take one of those roles... the biggest thing is they jell and work together which seems to be lacking in the current set upWe are in a hole right now, this is a dark period in our ABs history, whatever it takes to rebuild our tarnished legacy
I don't get the dark period, it's just a period where we haven't get a hell of a lot of WC players etc, it's happened before and will happen again. I actually thought we lasted quite well after professionalism came in to stay as high as we are.
In saying that I keen on a coach who has some overseas experience. -
@Dan54 said in New All Black Coach:
@canefan said in New All Black Coach:
@kidcalder said in New All Black Coach:
I don't give a shite which other nation a bloke has coached if he is qualified and best candidate he gets the gig.
Dave Rennie hell yeah - I see him as a guy to build the legacy back
Vern Cotter potentially as his forwards coach
Joe Schmitt in a Wayne Smith type role ( or as Razor sees himself without taking the head coach cap).
JJ could also take one of those roles... the biggest thing is they jell and work together which seems to be lacking in the current set upWe are in a hole right now, this is a dark period in our ABs history, whatever it takes to rebuild our tarnished legacy
I don't get the dark period, it's just a period where we haven't get a hell of a lot of WC players etc, it's happened before and will happen again. I actually thought we lasted quite well after professionalism came in to stay as high as we are.
In saying that I keen on a coach who has some overseas experience.What's not to get? I know you are a glass half full guy Dan, but don't let the eternal optimism blind you from the fact we aren't very good right now, from adminstration to coaching and down
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- Got pumped by some of our biggest rivals and just held on for a couple of wins
- We seem to lack an onfield identity and way to play
- We have failed to dominate the opposition in any games this year
- There seems to be lack of clarity in terms of communication between the coaches and the players. Also if rumours are to be believed players that we need in our team, such as Dalton, are now refusing to play for the group
- Stubbornness in selection. Players like Barrett are constantly played. We have built no depth and failed to experiment with any other 10s in 2 years
- We don't seem to be learning from our mistakes, for example our frailties when dealing with high balls
- We have an outgoing CEO who got us into bed with Silverlake, and most pundits now agree that the NZR have put commercialism over performance.
That feels pretty bleak to me!
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@canefan said in New All Black Coach:
@Dan54 said in New All Black Coach:
@canefan said in New All Black Coach:
@kidcalder said in New All Black Coach:
I don't give a shite which other nation a bloke has coached if he is qualified and best candidate he gets the gig.
Dave Rennie hell yeah - I see him as a guy to build the legacy back
Vern Cotter potentially as his forwards coach
Joe Schmitt in a Wayne Smith type role ( or as Razor sees himself without taking the head coach cap).
JJ could also take one of those roles... the biggest thing is they jell and work together which seems to be lacking in the current set upWe are in a hole right now, this is a dark period in our ABs history, whatever it takes to rebuild our tarnished legacy
I don't get the dark period, it's just a period where we haven't get a hell of a lot of WC players etc, it's happened before and will happen again. I actually thought we lasted quite well after professionalism came in to stay as high as we are.
In saying that I keen on a coach who has some overseas experience.What's not to get? I know you are a glass half full guy Dan, but don't let the eternal optimism blind you from the fact we aren't very good right now, from adminstration to coaching and down
Mate, perhaps I didn't put it right. I agree we on a low right now, just think I have seen a few over the years I have followed the game. Make no mistake, I a bit pissed at how things are looking etc , perhaps just seem to of recalled a few other times I felt similar.
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@Dan54 said in New All Black Coach:
@canefan said in New All Black Coach:
@Dan54 said in New All Black Coach:
@canefan said in New All Black Coach:
@kidcalder said in New All Black Coach:
I don't give a shite which other nation a bloke has coached if he is qualified and best candidate he gets the gig.
Dave Rennie hell yeah - I see him as a guy to build the legacy back
Vern Cotter potentially as his forwards coach
Joe Schmitt in a Wayne Smith type role ( or as Razor sees himself without taking the head coach cap).
JJ could also take one of those roles... the biggest thing is they jell and work together which seems to be lacking in the current set upWe are in a hole right now, this is a dark period in our ABs history, whatever it takes to rebuild our tarnished legacy
I don't get the dark period, it's just a period where we haven't get a hell of a lot of WC players etc, it's happened before and will happen again. I actually thought we lasted quite well after professionalism came in to stay as high as we are.
In saying that I keen on a coach who has some overseas experience.What's not to get? I know you are a glass half full guy Dan, but don't let the eternal optimism blind you from the fact we aren't very good right now, from adminstration to coaching and down
Mate, perhaps I didn't put it right. I agree we on a low right now, just think I have seen a few over the years I have followed the game. Make no mistake, I a bit pissed at how things are looking etc , perhaps just seem to of recalled a few other times I felt similar.
Our day will come again. We're too good to be held down. But at the moment, after the golden period, then the decline, we are in a trough. Not the first time I can remember, but it never feels good. Hopefully there isn't far to go before we hit rock bottom
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@Dan54 said in New All Black Coach:
@canefan Yep mate as I said I getting on a bit and seem to recall a few.
Which specific years do you think were as bad or worse that this year and last? The one that I’ve been comparing things to for the last couple of years is 1998.
But that 1998 team was full of fantastic players, while this current team has a couple, a few has-beens and a few who could be great if they realise their potential.
And the losses in 1998 were close. Three within one scoring play. Jeff Wilson scored a try in one match that would’ve won the game had there been a TMO at the time. The teams they lost to weren’t shabby either. That was Australia at their all time peak. This year’s team gets thrashed when they lose and scrapes by in games they should put away easily.
I think things are worse now.
