All Blacks 2025
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The case for Love (or another player) at first five comes down to this: is Barrett still playing at a level that gives the All Blacks a real shot at the 2027 World Cup, or is he already on a downward trajectory? If he's up to it, fine, keep him. If not, wouldn’t it be better to give someone else meaningful game time and see if they can surpass him by 2027? Barrett can still hang around - he’ll be the same player whether he plays every test or not.
If it were up to me, I’d have started McKenzie in all the games Barrett played last year and this year, with Love (given that's who's in the squad) now on the bench getting proper minutes - not just token cameos - and eventually starting if he shows enough ability.
That said, Robertson looks set on Mo'unga, which is risky in its own way. He wasn’t as good as Robertson seems to believe when he left and after his stint in Japan, there’s no guarantee he’ll come back at the required level.
@ShaquilleOatmeal said in All Blacks 2025:
The case for Love (or another player) at first five comes down to this: is Barrett still playing at a level that gives the All Blacks a real shot at the 2027 World Cup, or is he already on a downward trajectory? If he's up to it, fine, keep him. If not, wouldn’t it be better to give someone else meaningful game time and see if they can surpass him by 2027? Barrett can still hang around - he’ll be the same player whether he plays every test or not.
If it were up to me, I’d have started McKenzie in all the games Barrett played last year and this year, with Love (given that's who's in the squad) now on the bench getting proper minutes - not just token cameos - and eventually starting if he shows enough ability.
That said, Robertson looks set on Mo'unga, which is risky in its own way. He wasn’t as good as Robertson seems to believe when he left and after his stint in Japan, there’s no guarantee he’ll come back at the required level.
If Razor is marking time for RMs return, he risks getting him back diminished, and by the time he realises he's been sold a lemon we will be fucked for RWC27. He will have little margin for error
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2025:
So what's the NZR plan for the first five spot in 2028?
That is a while away yet. I think they will be hoping a Jacomb or a Simpson comes through the system.
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2025:
So what's the NZR plan for the first five spot in 2028?
We don't even seem to have a proper plan for 2025-26......
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Lots of people claim to be able to read Razor's mind.... and most likely before he even needs to think about it himself. Remarkable!
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Lots of people claim to be able to read Razor's mind.... and most likely before he even needs to think about it himself. Remarkable!
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2025:
So what's the NZR plan for the first five spot in 2028?
We have had similar concerns about other positions, especially lock and halfback. Both have righted themselves. With 10 we will be coming to the end of an era with Barrett and the departure of Mo'unga. McKenzie in theory should still be around. Jacomb will be 27 and probably making a decision about if he sees a future in NZ. Then there will be Simpson and Muliaina. Mika will have played three seasons and NPC level and two at Super.
The Chiefs will be pissed if they grudgingly agree to let Jacomb go and down the line him and Muliaina are both ABs out of the Landers.
Needs tend to right themselves.
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Reihana, it’s your time fella (in 2027)
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I agree @Dan54 no way Love could be considered at 10 for the ABs, he doesn't have nearly enough time there at the professional level. Right now he's a 15, but behind DMac and Jordan who are both clearly superior players.
If Love is serious about playing 10 then he needs to push his case with the Canes and play a full season there, not be shunted around to accommodate other players. He chose to play 15 a couple of years back when given the choice so I am not convinced he actually wants to be a 10 first.
@No-Quarter said in All Blacks 2025:
I agree @Dan54 no way Love could be considered at 10 for the ABs, he doesn't have nearly enough time there at the professional level. Right now he's a 15, but behind DMac and Jordan who are both clearly superior players.
If Love is serious about playing 10 then he needs to push his case with the Canes and play a full season there, not be shunted around to accommodate other players. He chose to play 15 a couple of years back when given the choice so I am not convinced he actually wants to be a 10 first.
I agree, but would be reasonably comfortable with him as the bench 10/15 right now, particularly if Jordie is at 12 and Roigard at 9, I think that works.
He comes on to play 15 most games, and if we're comfortable give him a go at 10. If we have a 10 injury, then we have a 9 and 12 (both hurricanes) who can kick and are experienced enough to take pressure off, and a pack who could just stick it up the jumper if needed. -
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2025:
So what's the NZR plan for the first five spot in 2028?
We have had similar concerns about other positions, especially lock and halfback. Both have righted themselves. With 10 we will be coming to the end of an era with Barrett and the departure of Mo'unga. McKenzie in theory should still be around. Jacomb will be 27 and probably making a decision about if he sees a future in NZ. Then there will be Simpson and Muliaina. Mika will have played three seasons and NPC level and two at Super.
The Chiefs will be pissed if they grudgingly agree to let Jacomb go and down the line him and Muliaina are both ABs out of the Landers.
Needs tend to right themselves.
@SouthernMann said in All Blacks 2025:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2025:
So what's the NZR plan for the first five spot in 2028?
We have had similar concerns about other positions, especially lock and halfback. Both have righted themselves. With 10 we will be coming to the end of an era with Barrett and the departure of Mo'unga. McKenzie in theory should still be around. Jacomb will be 27 and probably making a decision about if he sees a future in NZ. Then there will be Simpson and Muliaina. Mika will have played three seasons and NPC level and two at Super.
The Chiefs will be pissed if they grudgingly agree to let Jacomb go and down the line him and Muliaina are both ABs out of the Landers.
Needs tend to right themselves.
We are still short a young 2m TH lock. Patty T can’t go in forever and we need a backup to Tupou V.
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@SouthernMann said in All Blacks 2025:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2025:
So what's the NZR plan for the first five spot in 2028?
We have had similar concerns about other positions, especially lock and halfback. Both have righted themselves. With 10 we will be coming to the end of an era with Barrett and the departure of Mo'unga. McKenzie in theory should still be around. Jacomb will be 27 and probably making a decision about if he sees a future in NZ. Then there will be Simpson and Muliaina. Mika will have played three seasons and NPC level and two at Super.
The Chiefs will be pissed if they grudgingly agree to let Jacomb go and down the line him and Muliaina are both ABs out of the Landers.
Needs tend to right themselves.
We are still short a young 2m TH lock. Patty T can’t go in forever and we need a backup to Tupou V.
@pakman said in All Blacks 2025:
@SouthernMann said in All Blacks 2025:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2025:
So what's the NZR plan for the first five spot in 2028?
We have had similar concerns about other positions, especially lock and halfback. Both have righted themselves. With 10 we will be coming to the end of an era with Barrett and the departure of Mo'unga. McKenzie in theory should still be around. Jacomb will be 27 and probably making a decision about if he sees a future in NZ. Then there will be Simpson and Muliaina. Mika will have played three seasons and NPC level and two at Super.
The Chiefs will be pissed if they grudgingly agree to let Jacomb go and down the line him and Muliaina are both ABs out of the Landers.
Needs tend to right themselves.
We are still short a young 2m TH lock. Patty T can’t go in forever and we need a backup to Tupou V.
Lord
Darry
Holland
BeehreFor a start.
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@pakman said in All Blacks 2025:
@SouthernMann said in All Blacks 2025:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2025:
So what's the NZR plan for the first five spot in 2028?
We have had similar concerns about other positions, especially lock and halfback. Both have righted themselves. With 10 we will be coming to the end of an era with Barrett and the departure of Mo'unga. McKenzie in theory should still be around. Jacomb will be 27 and probably making a decision about if he sees a future in NZ. Then there will be Simpson and Muliaina. Mika will have played three seasons and NPC level and two at Super.
The Chiefs will be pissed if they grudgingly agree to let Jacomb go and down the line him and Muliaina are both ABs out of the Landers.
Needs tend to right themselves.
We are still short a young 2m TH lock. Patty T can’t go in forever and we need a backup to Tupou V.
Lord
Darry
Holland
BeehreFor a start.
@booboo said in All Blacks 2025:
@pakman said in All Blacks 2025:
@SouthernMann said in All Blacks 2025:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2025:
So what's the NZR plan for the first five spot in 2028?
We have had similar concerns about other positions, especially lock and halfback. Both have righted themselves. With 10 we will be coming to the end of an era with Barrett and the departure of Mo'unga. McKenzie in theory should still be around. Jacomb will be 27 and probably making a decision about if he sees a future in NZ. Then there will be Simpson and Muliaina. Mika will have played three seasons and NPC level and two at Super.
The Chiefs will be pissed if they grudgingly agree to let Jacomb go and down the line him and Muliaina are both ABs out of the Landers.
Needs tend to right themselves.
We are still short a young 2m TH lock. Patty T can’t go in forever and we need a backup to Tupou V.
Lord
Darry
Holland
BeehreFor a start.
I'm guessing they're considered LH?
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@booboo said in All Blacks 2025:
@pakman said in All Blacks 2025:
@SouthernMann said in All Blacks 2025:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2025:
So what's the NZR plan for the first five spot in 2028?
We have had similar concerns about other positions, especially lock and halfback. Both have righted themselves. With 10 we will be coming to the end of an era with Barrett and the departure of Mo'unga. McKenzie in theory should still be around. Jacomb will be 27 and probably making a decision about if he sees a future in NZ. Then there will be Simpson and Muliaina. Mika will have played three seasons and NPC level and two at Super.
The Chiefs will be pissed if they grudgingly agree to let Jacomb go and down the line him and Muliaina are both ABs out of the Landers.
Needs tend to right themselves.
We are still short a young 2m TH lock. Patty T can’t go in forever and we need a backup to Tupou V.
Lord
Darry
Holland
BeehreFor a start.
I'm guessing they're considered LH?
@Bones said in All Blacks 2025:
@booboo said in All Blacks 2025:
@pakman said in All Blacks 2025:
@SouthernMann said in All Blacks 2025:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2025:
So what's the NZR plan for the first five spot in 2028?
We have had similar concerns about other positions, especially lock and halfback. Both have righted themselves. With 10 we will be coming to the end of an era with Barrett and the departure of Mo'unga. McKenzie in theory should still be around. Jacomb will be 27 and probably making a decision about if he sees a future in NZ. Then there will be Simpson and Muliaina. Mika will have played three seasons and NPC level and two at Super.
The Chiefs will be pissed if they grudgingly agree to let Jacomb go and down the line him and Muliaina are both ABs out of the Landers.
Needs tend to right themselves.
We are still short a young 2m TH lock. Patty T can’t go in forever and we need a backup to Tupou V.
Lord
Darry
Holland
BeehreFor a start.
I'm guessing they're considered LH?
They're a lock. Just bind up and fucken push.
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@Bones said in All Blacks 2025:
@booboo said in All Blacks 2025:
@pakman said in All Blacks 2025:
@SouthernMann said in All Blacks 2025:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2025:
So what's the NZR plan for the first five spot in 2028?
We have had similar concerns about other positions, especially lock and halfback. Both have righted themselves. With 10 we will be coming to the end of an era with Barrett and the departure of Mo'unga. McKenzie in theory should still be around. Jacomb will be 27 and probably making a decision about if he sees a future in NZ. Then there will be Simpson and Muliaina. Mika will have played three seasons and NPC level and two at Super.
The Chiefs will be pissed if they grudgingly agree to let Jacomb go and down the line him and Muliaina are both ABs out of the Landers.
Needs tend to right themselves.
We are still short a young 2m TH lock. Patty T can’t go in forever and we need a backup to Tupou V.
Lord
Darry
Holland
BeehreFor a start.
I'm guessing they're considered LH?
They're a lock. Just bind up and fucken push.
@booboo said in All Blacks 2025:
@Bones said in All Blacks 2025:
@booboo said in All Blacks 2025:
@pakman said in All Blacks 2025:
@SouthernMann said in All Blacks 2025:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2025:
So what's the NZR plan for the first five spot in 2028?
We have had similar concerns about other positions, especially lock and halfback. Both have righted themselves. With 10 we will be coming to the end of an era with Barrett and the departure of Mo'unga. McKenzie in theory should still be around. Jacomb will be 27 and probably making a decision about if he sees a future in NZ. Then there will be Simpson and Muliaina. Mika will have played three seasons and NPC level and two at Super.
The Chiefs will be pissed if they grudgingly agree to let Jacomb go and down the line him and Muliaina are both ABs out of the Landers.
Needs tend to right themselves.
We are still short a young 2m TH lock. Patty T can’t go in forever and we need a backup to Tupou V.
Lord
Darry
Holland
BeehreFor a start.
I'm guessing they're considered LH?
They're a lock. Just bind up and fucken push.
Wing and lock solved in one fel...fow.... statement.
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@pakman said in All Blacks 2025:
@SouthernMann said in All Blacks 2025:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2025:
So what's the NZR plan for the first five spot in 2028?
We have had similar concerns about other positions, especially lock and halfback. Both have righted themselves. With 10 we will be coming to the end of an era with Barrett and the departure of Mo'unga. McKenzie in theory should still be around. Jacomb will be 27 and probably making a decision about if he sees a future in NZ. Then there will be Simpson and Muliaina. Mika will have played three seasons and NPC level and two at Super.
The Chiefs will be pissed if they grudgingly agree to let Jacomb go and down the line him and Muliaina are both ABs out of the Landers.
Needs tend to right themselves.
We are still short a young 2m TH lock. Patty T can’t go in forever and we need a backup to Tupou V.
Lord
Darry
Holland
BeehreFor a start.
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@Bones said in All Blacks 2025:
@booboo said in All Blacks 2025:
@pakman said in All Blacks 2025:
@SouthernMann said in All Blacks 2025:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2025:
So what's the NZR plan for the first five spot in 2028?
We have had similar concerns about other positions, especially lock and halfback. Both have righted themselves. With 10 we will be coming to the end of an era with Barrett and the departure of Mo'unga. McKenzie in theory should still be around. Jacomb will be 27 and probably making a decision about if he sees a future in NZ. Then there will be Simpson and Muliaina. Mika will have played three seasons and NPC level and two at Super.
The Chiefs will be pissed if they grudgingly agree to let Jacomb go and down the line him and Muliaina are both ABs out of the Landers.
Needs tend to right themselves.
We are still short a young 2m TH lock. Patty T can’t go in forever and we need a backup to Tupou V.
Lord
Darry
Holland
BeehreFor a start.
I'm guessing they're considered LH?
They're a lock. Just bind up and fucken push.
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@pakman said in All Blacks 2025:
@SouthernMann said in All Blacks 2025:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2025:
So what's the NZR plan for the first five spot in 2028?
We have had similar concerns about other positions, especially lock and halfback. Both have righted themselves. With 10 we will be coming to the end of an era with Barrett and the departure of Mo'unga. McKenzie in theory should still be around. Jacomb will be 27 and probably making a decision about if he sees a future in NZ. Then there will be Simpson and Muliaina. Mika will have played three seasons and NPC level and two at Super.
The Chiefs will be pissed if they grudgingly agree to let Jacomb go and down the line him and Muliaina are both ABs out of the Landers.
Needs tend to right themselves.
We are still short a young 2m TH lock. Patty T can’t go in forever and we need a backup to Tupou V.
Lord
Darry
Holland
BeehreFor a start.
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Well if you look at the current make up of the 23 (assuming no injuries):
- De Groot (Foster RWC 23 starter)
- Taylor (Hansen RWC 23 Starter)
- Newell (Foster)
- Scott Barrett (Hansen RWC 23 starter)
- Va’ai (Foster)
- Parker ( Robertson)
- Savea (Hansen RWC 23 starter)
- Sititi (Robertson)
- Roigard ( Foster Debut 23)
- Barrett (Hansen RWC 23 starter)
- Ioane ( Hansen RWC 23 starter)
- J Barrett (Hansen RWC 23 Starter)
- Proctor (Robertson)
- Narawa (Foster - debut 23 one cap)
- Jordan (Foster)
- Taukei’aho (Foster)
- Williams (Foster RWC 23 bench)
- Lomax (Foster RWC 23 starter)
- Holland (Robertson)
- Kirifi/Lakai (Robertson)
- Ratima (Robertson)
- Tupaea (Foster)
- Dmac (Hansen RWC 23 bench)
Hansen Debutants: 7
Foster: 10
Robertson: 6Out of Fosters 11: Roigard, Va’ai, Newell, Tupea, Narawa had limited opportunities.
So in the current 23, who exactly has Foster had the most time with? And any forwards in particular that are setting the world on fire that weren’t brought in by Jason Ryan? What exactly did Foster develop in his four years?
Obviously apart from the two stooges at 10, a defunct centre pairing, a backrow with no depth at 6 or 8. Beauden at fullback, Christie as your 2nd halfback?
And out of the barely capped Foster debutants, should any of them not be there and Robertson should have selected another player?
@jimmyb said in All Blacks 2025:
What exactly did Foster develop in his four years?
A team which lost the RWC by 1 point with 14 players?
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2025:
So what's the NZR plan for the first five spot in 2028?
